ʻEnelani: Aloha, koʻu inoa ʻo Eric Wilson. ʻO ke wikiō āu e ʻike ai i hoʻopaʻa ʻia i nā mau pule i hala aku nei, akā no ka maʻi, ʻaʻole hiki iaʻu ke hoʻopau a hiki i kēia manawa. ʻO ia ka mua o kekahi mau wikiō e kālailai ana i ke aʻo a ka Trinity.
Ke hana nei wau i ke wikiō me Kauka James Penton, he polofesa o ka mōʻaukala, ka mea kākau kaulana o kekahi mau akeakamai, he haumana Baibala, a he loea i ka naʻau haipule. Ua manaʻo mākou ua hiki i ka manawa e hōʻuluʻulu ai i kā mākou kumuwaiwai a nānā i kahi aʻo aʻo no ka hapanui ka hōʻailona o ka hoʻomana Kalikiano. Pēlā anei ʻoe? Pono paha ke kanaka e ʻae i ke Trinity e helu ʻia e ke Akua ma ke ʻano Karistiano? Ke manaʻo nei kēia hoa.
[Hōʻike wikiō]
I ka manawa hea i lilo ai ka hilinaʻi i ke Trinity i pōhaku kumu o ka hoʻomana Kalikiano? Ua ʻōlelo ʻo Iesū e ʻike ka poʻe i ka hoʻomana Kalikiano maoli e nā aloha Kalikiano e hōʻike ai kekahi i kekahi. He moʻolelo lōʻihi paha ko nā poʻe Tritarians e hōʻike nei i ke aloha no ka poʻe i ʻaelike ʻole me lākou? E waiho mākou i ka mōʻaukala e pane i kēlā nīnau.
I kēia manawa e ʻōlelo kekahi poʻe he mea ʻole ia i ka mea a mākou e manaʻoʻiʻo ai. Hiki iā ʻoe ke manaʻoʻiʻo i ka mea āu e makemake ai e manaʻoʻiʻo, a hiki iaʻu ke manaʻoʻiʻo i ka mea aʻu e makemake ai e manaʻoʻiʻo. Aloha ʻo Iesū iā kākou āpau ke aloha iā ia a me kekahi i kekahi.
Ina he kumu ka mea, no ke aha ia i ʻōlelo aku ai i ka wahine ma ka luawai, "e hiki mai ana ka hora, a eia hoʻi aia nei, ka poʻe e hoʻomana pono ai i ka Makua ma ka ʻUhane a me ka ʻoiaʻiʻo. ʻAe, makemake ka makua i nā poʻe like ʻole iā ia. He ʻuhane ke Akua, a ʻo ka poʻe hoʻomana iā ia e hoʻomana i ka ʻUhane a me ka ʻoiaʻiʻo. (Ioane 4:23, 24 Christian Christian Bible)
Ke ʻimi nei ke Akua i ka poʻe hoʻomana iā ia ma ka ʻuhane a me ka ʻoiaʻiʻo. No laila, he mea nui ka ʻoiaʻiʻo.
Akā, ʻaʻohe loaʻa i ka ʻoiaʻiʻo a pau. Loaʻa iā mākou a pau nā mea hewa ʻole.
ʻOiaʻiʻo, akā pehea ke alakaʻi e alakaʻi ai iā mākou? He aha ka mea e koi ai iā mākou e ʻimi pono i ka ʻoiaʻiʻo a ʻaʻole e māʻona i ka ʻenehana ʻōiwi i ka manawa?
Ua haʻi aku ʻo Paulo i ka poʻe Tesalonike no ka poʻe e nalowale ana i ke ola: "E pau ana lākou, no ka mea ʻaʻole lākou e aloha i ka ʻoiaʻiʻo a ola lākou." (2 Tesalonia 2:10)
ʻO ke aloha, e aloha maoli i ka ʻoiaʻiʻo, e hoʻoikaika iā mākou inā e loaʻa iā mākou ka lokomaikaʻi ʻia e ke Akua.
ʻOiaʻiʻo, ke nīnau ʻia, koi nā kānaka āpau e aloha i ka ʻoiaʻiʻo. Akā e hana pono ma kahi ʻino ma aneʻi. Ehia mau mea aloha iā ia? Inā makua ʻoe, aloha ʻoe i kāu poʻe keiki? Maopopo iaʻu. Make paha ʻoe no kāu poʻe keiki? Manaʻo wau e hāʻawi ka hapanui o nā mākua i ko lākou ola iho e mālama i kā lākou keiki.
ʻĀnō, e nīnau wau iā ʻoe i kēia: Ua aloha aloha ʻoe? Ae. E make anei ʻoe no ia? E makemake paha ʻoe e hāʻawi i kou ola ma mua o ka mōhai ʻana i ka ʻoiaʻiʻo?
Na Iesu i hana. Ua hana nā Karistiano he nui pēlā. Eia nō naʻe, ehia o ka poʻe e kapa iā lākou he Karistiano i kēia lā e make no ka ʻoiaʻiʻo?
ʻO wau a me Jim mai kahi ʻōnaehana manaʻoʻiʻo e wehewehe iā ia iho "ʻo ka ʻoiaʻiʻo". E nīnau maʻa mau kahi hōʻike a Iesū iā IW i kekahi JW a lākou i ʻike wale ai, "Pehea kou lōʻihi i ka ʻoiaʻiʻo?", A i ʻole, "Āhea ʻoe i ʻike ai i ka ʻoiaʻiʻo?" ʻO ka mea a lākou e manaʻo ai e nīnau, ʻo ia ka lōʻihi o ka lilo ʻana o kēlā kanaka i lālā no ka hui o nā ʻIke o Iēhova.
Kuhi lākou i ka kūpaʻa i ka ʻoihana me ke aloha i ka ʻoiaʻiʻo. Akā e hoʻāʻo i ko lākou aloha i ka ʻoiaʻiʻo a, i kaʻu ʻike ākea ākea, ua nalowale ka ʻoiaʻiʻo. E ʻōlelo i ka ʻoiaʻiʻo iā lākou a loaʻa iā ʻoe ka mea hōʻino, hōʻino a me ka pale ʻana i ka hoʻihoʻi. I ka pōkole, ka hoʻomaʻau.
ʻO ka hoʻomāinoino i ka poʻe e ʻōlelo i ka ʻoiaʻiʻo he mea ʻokoʻa ia i nā ʻIke o Iēhova. I ka ʻoiaʻiʻo, ka hoʻomaʻau ʻana i kekahi no ka mea ʻaʻole lākou e kūlike me kou manaʻo he hae ʻulaʻula nui ia, ʻeā? ʻO wau e ʻōlelo nei, inā he ʻoiaʻiʻo kāu, inā pololei ʻoe, ʻaʻole anei ia e ʻōlelo nona iho? ʻAʻole pono e hoʻouka i ke kanaka e kūlike ʻole. ʻAʻole pono e puhi iā lākou i ka pahu.
Aia i kēia mau hiʻohiʻona o ka moʻomeheu Trinity a ke nānā nei mākou iā lākou āpau i kēia mahele o nā wikiō, akā e mahalo mākou i ka hapanui o kā mākou nānā nui i ka mea i makemake nui ʻia ma waena o ka lehulehu o nā hoʻomana Karistiano i hana i kēia mau lā.
I mua, ʻaʻole wau a me Jim e ʻae i ke Trinity, ʻoiai mākou e ʻae he akua ʻo Iesū. ʻO ia hoʻi, i kekahi ʻāpana, ʻae mākou iā Iesū ma ke ʻano he akua e pili ana i ko mākou ʻike i nā ʻano Palapala Hemolele a mākou e hele ai. E hoʻāʻo ka poʻe e pigeonhole iā mākou, e hoʻokuʻu iā mākou me ka hoʻowahāwahā e like me ka poʻe Arian a i ʻole nā Unitarians a i ʻole ka lumi pani o nā hōʻike a Iēhova - i waho, akā i loko. ʻAʻohe o kēlā mea pololei.
Ua ʻike wau mai ka ʻike e loaʻa i kahi poʻe Tritarians kahi ala liʻiliʻi e hoʻopau ai i ka hōʻeha i ko lākou manaʻoʻiʻo. He ʻano ia o "cliché hoʻopau manaʻo". Penei e like me kēia: “ʻ,, manaʻo ʻoe he Makua kaawale ka Makua a me ke Keiki? ʻAʻole anei kēlā hoʻomana akua? "
No ka mea ʻo ka polytheism ke ʻano hoʻomana kiʻi i pili me ka paganism, hoʻāʻo lākou e hoʻopau i nā kūkākūkā a pau e nā mea nāna e hōʻa ʻole ʻole i kā lākou aʻo ʻana ma ka pale.
Akā hiki paha paha ʻoe e pale aku ʻo Trinitarians pū kekahi poluʻenehana me kā lākou ʻekolu i ka manawa hoʻokahi o ke Akua? ʻOiaʻiʻo, ʻaʻole. Ua haʻi lākou he monotheist, e like me nā Iudaio. E ʻike ʻoe, ke manaʻoʻiʻo nei lākou i ke Akua hoʻokahi. ʻEkolu mau ʻokoʻa a hoʻokaʻawale hoʻi, akā hoʻokahi hoʻokahi ke Akua.
Ua hoʻohana lākou i kēia kiʻikuhi e wehewehe i ka ʻōlelo: [Triangle mai https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trinity]
Hāʻawi kēia iā lākou i hoʻokahi wale nō, akā ʻaʻole ia he kanaka, akā ʻekolu mau kānaka. Pehea e lilo ai ka mea hoʻokahi i ʻekolu mau kānaka? Pehea ʻoe e hoʻopili ai i kou noʻonoʻo a puni kahi paradox. ʻIke lākou i kēia ʻoi aku ka hiki i ka noʻonoʻo kanaka ke hopu, akā wehewehe ia mea he pohihihi akua.
Ano, no mākou o ka poʻe manaʻoʻiʻo i ke Akua, ʻaʻohe pilikia o nā mea pohihihi ʻaʻole hiki iā mākou ke hoʻomaopopo i ka wā e ʻike ʻia ai ma ka Palapala Hemolele. ʻAʻole haʻaheo mākou e like me ka ʻōlelo ʻana inā hiki ʻole iā mākou ke hoʻomaopopo i kahi mea a laila hiki ʻole keʻoiaʻiʻo. Inā e ʻōlelo mai ke Akua iā mākou i kekahi mea, pēlā nō.
Eia nō naʻe, ua hōʻike akāka ʻia ke aʻo ʻana o ke Trinity i ka Palapala Hemolele i kahi ala, ʻoiai ʻaʻole wau e maopopo, pono wau e ʻae ia mea he ʻoiaʻiʻo. Ua lohe wau i ka poʻe Tritarians e ʻōlelo nei i kēia ʻōlelo. Kupanaha, ʻaʻole lākou e ukali iā ia me kahi kuhikuhi maopopo i kēlā ʻōlelo hemolele. Akā, ʻo ka mea e ukali nei he laina o ke kumu hoʻoliʻiliʻi kanaka. ʻAʻole ia he manaʻo hewa lākou e pili ana i kā lākou hoʻoliʻiliʻi, akā he ʻōlelo akāka i loko o ka Baibala kekahi mea, ʻoiai ʻo ka wehewehe kanaka kahi mea ʻē aʻe.
Eia nō naʻe, ʻelua mau manawa ʻelua, no ka poʻe Trinitarians, polytheism a me ka monotheism me ka mea he mua me ka poʻe paganana a ʻo ka Christian i hope.
Eia nō naʻe, he hoʻolaha wikiwiki kēlā. ʻIke ʻoe, ʻaʻole hiki iā mākou ke hoʻonohonoho i nā ʻōlelo o kā mākou hoʻomana. Na ke Akua nō. ʻ tellslelo ke Akua iā mākou pehea mākou e hoʻomana ai iā ia, a laila pono mākou e ʻike i nā huaʻōlelo e wehewehe ai i kāna mea i ʻōlelo ai. E like me ka mea i hoʻololi ʻia, ʻaʻole "monotheism" a me "polytheism" e wehewehe pono i ka hoʻomana ʻana iā Yavea a i ʻole iā IEHOV e like me ka mea i kākau ʻia ma ka Palapala Hemolele. E ʻoki ana wau i kahi kūkā kamaʻilio me aʻu e pili ana iā Jim e pili ana i kēia kumuhana. E alakaʻi wau iā ia ma ka nīnau ʻana iā Jim i kēia nīnau:
“E Jim, hiki iā ʻoe ke haʻi iā mākou inā ua hele mai kekahi e haʻi aʻe i ka wehewehe ʻana i ka pilina ma waena o ka Makua a me ke Keiki a me kā mākou hoʻomana ʻana iā lākou?
Jim: ʻAe hiki iaʻu.
Aia kekahi huaʻōlelo hou i hui pū ʻia ma 1860, i ka makahiki ma mua o ka hoʻoili ʻia ʻana o ke Kaua Kipila ʻAmelika e kekahi kanaka e ka inoa ʻo Max Muller. ʻO kēia mea āna i hele ai me ka huaʻōlelo "henotheistic". I ke ano o ke aha? E ʻo Heno, he Akua hoʻokahi, akā ʻo ka manaʻo, eia ka hoʻokahi: aia kahi, a he luna, he Akua kiʻekiʻe, ʻo ia ke Akua ma luna o nā mea a pau, a ua kapa ʻia ke Akua iā Iēhova a i ʻole ma mua, ʻo Iēhova. Akā ma o Iēhova a ʻo Iēhova, aia nō kekahi mau mea i ʻike ʻia i nā akua, elohim. Ano, o ka olelo no ke Akua ma ka Hebera nā akua, akā maʻa mau ke nānā mua iā ia e ʻōlelo he, he akua Plural kēlā. I nā huaʻōlelo ʻē aʻe, ʻoi aku ka manaʻo ma mua o hoʻokahi akua. Akā ke hoʻolako ʻia me nā verba singular, hoʻokahi akua ia, a ʻo kēia kahi hihia o ka ʻōnaehana i kapa ʻia ka plural of Majesty. Ua like ia me ka ʻōlelo a ka Mōʻīwahine Victoria, "ʻaʻole mākou i leʻaleʻa". ʻĀ, ʻo ia hoʻokahi akā no ka mea he aliʻi mōʻī ia, ua hoʻohana ʻo ia i ka plural no nona iho; a i loko o ka Palapala Hemolele, ʻo Iēhova a ʻo Iēhova paha e ʻōlelo maʻamau ʻia Elohim, Ke Akua i ka planania, akā me nā huaʻōlelo e kū ana ma ka hoʻokahi.
I kēia manawa, ke hoʻohana ʻia ka huaʻōlelo a Elohima me nā huaʻōlelo maro, ʻo ia hoʻi ke Akua, a pēlā nō, e nānā kāua i kēia mea ke pili nei i ka Old Testament a me ke Kauoha Hou.
ʻEnelani: Mahalo. No laila, ʻaʻole ka manaʻo ka plurality e ka huaʻōlelo, akā ma ka ʻano kuʻōlelo.
Jim: Pololei kēnā.
ʻEnelani: ʻAe, no laila ua loaʻa maoli iaʻu kahi ʻano o kēlā. E hōʻike hou i ke ʻano, ke hōʻike aku nei au i kēia manawa.
ʻElua mea e pono ai e noʻonoʻo e pili ana iā Elohim ma ka Hebera. ʻO ka mea mua inā pololei ka mea a Jim i ʻōlelo ai — he kūkulu grammatical ia, ʻaʻole e hōʻike ana i ka plural, akā he ʻano e like me ka maikaʻi a me ka Mōʻī paha; a e hoʻoholo e pono mākou e hele i kahi ʻē ma ka Baibala kahi e hiki ai iā mākou ke ʻike i ka hōʻoia he incontestable ʻole ia, a manaʻo wau hiki iā mākou ke loaʻa ma 1 Nūhou 11:33. Inā mākou e hele i 1 Nūhou 11:33, e loaʻa iā mākou ma aneʻi i ka BibleHub, kahi kumu waiwai maikaʻi loa no ka noiʻi ʻana i ka Baibala ma nā mana he nui. Ke nānā nei mākou i 1 Nūhou 11:33 ma ka Baibala NIV loaʻa iā mākou: "E hana wau i kēia no ka mea ua haʻalele lākou iaʻu a hoʻomana iā ʻAsetereta ke akua wahine [singular] o ko Sidona, ʻo Kemosa ke akua o ka Moaba, a ʻo Moleka ke akua [singular] o ka ʻAmona… ”
ʻAe, e nānā pehea i hoʻokau ʻia ai nā inoa inoa hoʻokahi i ka ʻōlelo Pelekania i loko o ke kumu, a ma ka interlinear ʻike mākou i kēlā me kēia manawa e ʻōlelo ʻia ai ke akua a i ʻole ke akua wahine e loaʻa iā mākou ʻo Elohim — 430 [e]. Eia hou, "akua wahine" 430, Akua, a eia hoʻi, ke "akua", Elohim 430. E hōʻoia wale nō - ka concordance a ka Mea ikaika - a ʻike mākou i kēlā Elohim eia ka huaʻōlelo i hoʻohana ʻia ma ia mau wahi ʻekolu. No laila, me he mea lā maopopo leʻa ke hana nei mākou me kahi kūkulu grammatical. Eia nō naʻe, ʻo ka mea hoʻohenehene o ia mau mea ke hoʻāʻo ka mea e manaʻoʻiʻo i ka Trinity e hāpai i ka manaʻo o ke akua akua a i ʻole ka plurality o IEHOVA — ʻo nā kānaka ʻekolu i ka mea hoʻokahi - ua ʻike ʻia, a i ʻole ma ke ʻano e hōʻike ʻia ma nā Palapala Hebera ma o ka hoʻohana ʻana. Elohim, ke hāʻawi nei lākou i nā henotheist, e like me Jim a me I, kahi kahua maikaʻi loa no ko mākou kūlana, no ka mea, hoʻokumu ʻia ka trinitaryism ma luna o ka manaʻo holoʻokoʻa he hoʻokahi wale nō ke Akua. He monotheistic ia; Hoʻokahi Akua, ʻekolu mau kino i loko o ke Akua hoʻokahi. No laila, inā i kuhikuhi ʻo Iēhova ma ke ʻano he Elohim, Lehova Elohim, ʻO Iēhova ke Akua, a i ʻole ʻo Iēhova ke Akua e ʻōlelo nei e pili ana i nā akua he nui, e hahai ana ia e pili ana i ka henotheism, e like me kā Jim he keiki kekahi i Akua. "The word is a God" a pēlā Elohim hana maikaʻi loa e kākoʻo i ka manaʻo henotheist, a no laila, i ka manawa hou e hele ai kekahi i mua iaʻu, manaʻo wau ma kahi o ka hoʻopaʻapaʻa grammatical, e ʻōlelo wale wau, "ʻAe, kupanaha kēlā. ʻAe wau i kēlā, a hōʻike kēlā i kā mākou manaʻo — henotheism. ” ʻOiai, e leʻaleʻa iki ana ma laila.
Ma mua o ka hele ʻana, ua hānai ʻoe i kahi mea aʻu e manaʻo ai e haʻohaʻo nei kā mākou mea nānā. Ua ʻōlelo ʻoe he ʻano hou ʻo Yawe a ʻo Iēhova ka hana kahiko o ka unuhi ʻana a YHWH. ʻO ia ka hihia? He ʻano hou loa anei ʻo Iēhova?
Jim: ʻAe, he… a he ʻano ia e hoʻopaʻapaʻa ʻia, akā ua ʻae ʻia e ka hui kaiaulu e hōʻike ana i ka inoa e pono ai. Akā ʻaʻohe mea i ʻike, i ka ʻoiaʻiʻo. Hoʻokahi wale nō kuhi maikaʻi kēlā.
ʻEnelani: Akau. ʻIke wau he nui nā hoʻopaʻapaʻa e pili ana iā Iēhova. Nui ka poʻe e manaʻo he inoa wahaheʻe ia, akā ʻoiaʻiʻo ʻaʻole kokoke paha ia i ka ʻōlelo kumu i kēia manawa e like me ia i ka manawa i hana mua ʻia ai i ke kenekulia 12. A i ʻole ke kenekulia 13? 1260, manaʻo wau. E hoʻomanaʻo wau. E ʻike ʻoe ma mua o ka I. Akā, ʻo "J" i kēlā manawa he yah kani.
Jim: ʻAe, e like me ia ma nā ʻōlelo Kelemania a me Scandinavian, a ʻo Hōlani paha a hiki i kēia lā. He "Y" ke kani o ka "J". A ʻo ia ka mea e komo i ka moʻolelo o ka hoʻohana ʻana o “J” ʻaʻole mākou e hana ma aneʻi.
ʻEnelani: Akau. Maikaʻi loa. Mahalo. Makemake wale e uhi i kēlā. ʻIke wau e loaʻa ana iā mākou nā manaʻo ma kēlā laina, inā ʻaʻole mākou e kamaʻilio i kēia manawa.
No laila, aia no kekahi mea āu e makemake ai e hoʻohui, aia wau aia kekahi mea mai ka Salamo 82 āu i ʻōlelo ai ma mua iaʻu e pili ana i kēia.
Jim: ʻAe, hauʻoli wau i kou hāpai ʻana i kēlā mea no ka mea he hiʻohiʻona maikaʻi loa ia o ka henotheism e like me kā Max Muller e wehewehe ai. ʻO ia nō, ”ʻ saidlelo wau he akua ʻoukou, a he poʻe keiki ʻoukou a pau na ka Mea kiʻekiʻe loa.” ʻAʻole kēlā ʻo ka Halelu 82 paukū 1 akā e hele ana i 6 a 7. Hōʻike ia e pili ana i ke Akua e noho ana i ke anaina o ke Akua. Nāna e hoʻokolokolo ma waena o nā akua. "Ua ʻōlelo au he akua ʻoukou a he poʻe keiki ʻoukou na ka Mea kiʻekiʻe loa."
No laila, eia ke Akua e noho nei i ka anaina o nā akua; a he nui na hihia o keia ma na Halelu. ʻAʻole wau e hoʻopilikia i ka kikoʻī ma aneʻi, akā hāʻawi kēia i ke kiʻi a i kekahi manawa, ʻoiai, he mau akua wahaheʻe paha nā ʻānela pono. ʻIke ʻia, pili kēia huaʻōlelo i nā ʻānela, a i kekahi mau hihia ua pili i nā akua hoʻomana a i ʻole akua wahine hoʻomana - aia kekahi hihia ma ke Kauoha Kahiko - a laila pili ʻia i nā ʻānela, a me nā kāne ma lalo o kekahi mau kūlana.
ʻEnelani: Maikaʻi loa. Mahalo. ʻOiaʻiʻo, aia kahi papa inoa o nā Palapala Hemolele āu i hoʻohui pū ai. Ma mua o ka hiki iā mākou ke uhi ma aneʻi. No laila, ua hoʻokau wau iā lākou i kahi palapala a me ka poʻe makemake e ʻike i ka papa inoa holoʻokoʻa ... E kau wau i kahi loulou i ka wehewehe ʻana o kēia wikiō i hiki iā lākou ke hoʻoiho i ka palapala a nānā iā ia i ko lākou wā leʻaleʻa.
Jim: E maikaʻi kēlā.
ʻEnelani: Mahalo. Haawi mai i nā mea a pau āu i ʻōlelo ai, aia nō kahi hōʻailona ma ka palapala hemolele mua-Kalani, a i ʻole e kapa ʻia e ka poʻe he nui o ka Old Old, o Iesū he Akua i loko o ka hoʻonohonoho henotheistic?
Jim: ʻĀ, e ʻae ʻoe iaʻu e ʻōlelo i ka hoʻi i Genesus, aia ʻelua mau manawa kahi maopopo loa o kēia loina o ka henotheism. ʻO kekahi ma ka moʻolelo ma mua o Noa kahi a ka Palapala Hemolele e kamaʻilio ai e pili ana i nā keiki kāne a ke Akua e iho mai ana a e mare ana i nā kaikamahine a kānaka. ʻO ia kekahi o nā hihia, nā keiki a ke Akua. No laila, lilo lākou i mau akua i loko o lākou iho a i ʻike ʻia he akua. ʻO kēia mau ʻānela hāʻule e like me ka wehewehe ʻana i loko o ka puke apocryphal o Enoka, a ma 2 Petero. A no laila iā ʻoe kēlā, akā ʻo ka mea nui ʻē aʻe i loko o ka puke o Nā ʻ Proverbslelo ʻOlelo kahi e pili ai i ke kumuhana o ke akamai. I kēia manawa e ʻōlelo maʻalahi ka poʻe ʻepekema, 'ʻĀ, ʻo kēia… eia nā ʻano o Iēhova a ʻaʻole pono e hōʻike ʻia i ke kanaka a i ʻole hypostasis ”. Akā i ke kiko o ka ʻoiaʻiʻo e like me ka hala ʻana o ka manawa, a ma ke ʻano hoʻi o ka wahi o ke Kauoha Hou, i ka hoʻomaka, a maliʻa paha e ʻōlelo wau ma mua, e loaʻa iā ʻoe kahi noiʻi o ka mea āpau o ka naʻauao e lilo i ʻano kanaka, a ʻo kēia i loko o ka puke naʻauao, a me nā hana a ka Iudaio ʻAlikana, ʻo Philo, ka mea i hele a noho pū me Iesū Kristo a ua kamaʻilio ʻo ia me kēia huaʻōlelo. logos, kahi e hōʻike ai i kahi mea like me ke akamai i loko o ka puke o Nā ʻlelo a me ka puke o ka naʻauao. I kēia manawa no ke aha e pili ana i kēia, a pehea paha e pili ana i kēia, e ʻōlelo wau? ʻĀ, ʻo ka ʻoiaʻiʻo o nā huaʻōlelo a me nā lepili, e hilinaʻi ana inā makemake ʻoe e haʻi iā ia he pōkole a lōʻihi paha O-ʻo nā Iudaio a i ʻole nā Helene i ka lā o Kristo e hui pū i nā mea ʻelua i nā manawa āpau, no laila manaʻo wau ʻO wau kahi manawaleʻa i… ma ke kūʻokoʻa e… hana i ka mea like — a i kēlā me kēia hihia, aia ka huaʻōlelo i loko o kā mākou huaʻōlelo Pelekane “logika”, “logical” mai nā logos a i ʻole nā logos, a lawe pū ʻia ka manaʻo o ka noʻonoʻo pono a no laila like loa me ke akamai, a ʻo Philo i lalo ma Alexandria o ʻAigupita i ʻike i ke akamai a me nā lepe e like me ka mea like, a me ke ʻano.
Ua kuhikuhi ka poʻe he nui i ka ʻoiaʻiʻo o ka ʻōlelo akamai i loko o ʻ Proverbslelo Pepelu he wahine wahine, akā ʻaʻole ia i hoʻopilikia iki iā Philo. ʻLelo ʻo ia, “ʻAe a ʻo ia ka hihia, akā hiki ke hoʻomaopopo ʻia he kāne kāne pū kekahi. A i ʻole ma ke ʻano he kāne ka lōkō; no laila hiki ke hōʻike i ka naʻauao i kahi kāne kāne a i ʻole hypostasis.
ʻEnelani: Akau.
Jim: I kēia manawa, hana nui ʻia kēia mau mea i nā palapala a ka mea kaulana Karistiano ʻepekema Kinohi, a hana ʻo ia me kēia i ka lōʻihi. No laila, he aha kāu ma aneʻi kahi mea i kū kikoʻī ʻia i ka wā o Iesū, a ʻoiai ua hoʻopiʻi ka poʻe Parisaio iā Iesu no ka hōʻino ʻana no ka ʻōlelo ʻana he keiki ia na ke Akua, ua ʻōlelo pololei ʻo ia mai nā Halelu a kuhikuhi aku ua ʻōlelo ʻia nā akua. o, nā akua he nui, a no laila ua ʻōlelo ʻo ia, 'Aia ma laila. Kākau ʻia. ʻAʻole hiki iā ʻoe ke kānalua. ʻAʻole wau e hōʻino wale. No laila, aia ka manaʻo i ka manawa o Kristo.
ʻEnelani: Akau. Mahalo. ʻOiaʻiʻo, ua manaʻo mau wau he kūpono e hoʻokau iā Christ a me ka mua ma mua o ka Kalikiano a i ʻole ʻo Iesū ma mua e like me nā logos no ka mea, ma ke ʻano he naʻauao, no ka mea ke maopopo iaʻu, hiki ke wehewehe ʻia ka naʻauao e like me ka hoʻohana pono ʻana o ka ʻike. . ʻIke ʻoe, ʻike paha wau i kekahi mea akā inā ʻaʻole wau e hana i kekahi mea me ka ʻike, ʻaʻole naʻauao wau; inā pili wau i koʻu ʻike, a laila naʻauao wau. A ʻo ka hana ʻana i ke ao holoʻokoʻa ma o Iesu lā, na Iesū, a na Iesū, ka hōʻike nui loa o ka hoʻohana pono ʻana o ka ʻike ma mua. No laila, pili pono ka naʻauao pilikino me kāna kuleana ma ke ʻano he limahana poʻokela o ke Akua, inā makemake ʻoe, e hoʻohana i kahi manawa i hele mai mai ko mākou hilinaʻi kahiko.
Akā he mea ʻē aʻe āu e makemake ai e hoʻohui i ia mea ... e lawe ana ʻoe mai Pilipi 2: 5-8? Ua ʻōlelo ʻoe noʻu i kahi mua no ka preexistence o Kristo; no ka mea aia kekahi poʻe kanalua i kana ʻoiai ke manaʻo nei, ua hele a ʻano wale ʻo ia ma ke ʻano he kanaka, a ʻo ka mea ma mua.
Jim: Ae. Lawe ʻia kēlā kūlana e nā hui like ʻole, nā hui ʻole Trinitary, a aia nō kekahi o lākou, a me kā lākou manaʻo hoʻopaʻapaʻa ʻaʻole ʻo Kelistiano ma mua o kona ola kanaka. ʻAʻole ʻo ia i ka lani, akā ua ʻōlelo kikoʻī ka huaʻōlelo ma Pilipi ka mokuna ʻelua - a ke hāʻawi nei ʻo Paul iā ʻoe i kahi laʻana o ka hoʻohaʻahaʻa ma laila kahi e kākau nei e pili ana i kēia — a ua ʻōlelo ʻo ia ʻaʻole ʻo ia i hoʻāʻo i ka hopena — ʻo wau paraphrasing here ma mua o ka puana ʻana - ʻaʻole ʻo ia i hoʻāʻo e hopu i ke kūlana o ka Makua akā hoʻohaʻahaʻa ʻo ia iā ia iho a lawe i ke ʻano o ke kāne, ʻoiai ʻo ia i ke Akua; Ke ʻano o ke Akua, ma ke ʻano o ka makuakāne. ʻAʻole ʻo ia i hoʻāʻo e kāʻili i ke kūlana o ke Akua e like me kā Sātana i manaʻo ai e hoʻāʻo, akā ua ʻae ʻo ia i ka hoʻolālā a ke Akua a hāʻawi i kāna ʻano ʻuhane a iho i ka honua i ke ʻano o kahi kāne. Maopopo loa kēia. Inā makemake kekahi e heluhelu i ka mokuna ʻelua o Pilipi. No laila, hōʻike maopopo kēia i ka preexistence iaʻu, a ʻaʻole hiki iaʻu ke loaʻa he paʻakikī loa e hele a puni kēlā.
A ʻoiai, aia kekahi mau palapala ʻē aʻe ʻē aʻe i hiki ke hāpai ʻia. He puke kaʻu i paʻi ʻia e kekahi mau keonimana ʻelua i pili i ka Ekalesia o ke Akua, Faith of Abraham, a hoʻāʻo lākou e hoʻopau i ka manaʻo o ka preexistence, e ʻōlelo ana, 'ʻAe, ʻaʻole… kūpono kēia i ka manaʻo Iudaio. , a ke manaʻo nei wau he kuhi weliweli kēlā inā ʻoe e kamaʻilio e pili ana i ka manaʻo Iudaio a i ʻole ka manaʻo Helene a i ʻole ka manaʻo o kekahi, no ka mea aia nā manaʻo ʻokoʻa i loko o nā kaiāulu āpau a e ʻōlelo paha ʻaʻole he Hebera i manaʻo i ka preexistence he mea lapuwale. ʻOiai, ua hana ʻo Philo i ʻAigupita, a he wā ia no Iesu Kristo.
ʻEnelani: Akau.
Jim: A makemake wale lākou e ʻōlelo i kēlā, 'ʻĀ, ʻo kēia kā ke Akua wānana ʻana i ka mea e hiki mai ana i ka wā e hiki mai ana. A ʻaʻole lākou e hakakā pū me kēia mau paukū e hōʻike nei i ka preexistence.
ʻEnelani: ʻAe. Ua paʻakikī loa lākou e hana aku no laila nānā ʻole lākou iā lākou. Mahalo paha wau inā paha ka mea a mākou e ʻike nei ma ke kaiāulu e kākoʻo nei i ka preexistence e like me ka mea a mākou e ʻike nei i nā ʻIke o Iēhova e hoʻāʻo nei e haʻalele i ka Trinity a hele lākou i kahi ʻē aʻe. Ua hoʻolilo nā mea ʻike iā Iesū i ʻānela wale nō, ʻoiai he ʻānela nui, a ʻo kēia mau hui ʻē aʻe e hoʻolilo iā ia i kanaka, ʻaʻole i preexist. pono nā mea ʻelua ... maikaʻi, ʻaʻole pono… akā nā hopena ʻelua i, manaʻo wau, ʻo ke aʻo Trinity, akā ʻoi aku ka nui; hele loa i kahi ala ʻē.
Jim: Pololei kēlā, a ua hana nā mea hōʻike i kekahi mea i loko o kekahi manawa. I kēia manawa, i koʻu wā ʻōpio i loko o nā hōʻike a Iēhova. ʻAʻohe kānalua he nui ka mahalo iā Kristo a no kekahi manawa lōʻihi, pule nā mea hōʻike iā Kristo a mahalo iā Kristo; a i nā makahiki i hala, heʻoiaʻiʻo, ua pau lākou i kēlā, a ʻōlelo ʻaʻole pono ʻoe e pule iā Kristo, ʻaʻole pono ʻoe e hoʻomana iā Kristo. E hoʻomana wale ʻoe i ka Makua; a ua lawe lākou i kahi kūlana Iudaio koʻikoʻi loa. I kēia manawa ke kuhikuhi nei wau i ka poʻe Parisaio a me nā Iudaio i kūʻē iā Kristo i ka lawe ʻana i kēlā kūlana, no ka mea, aia nā ʻāpana he nui i loko o ke Kauoha Hou kahi e kuhikuhi ai, ʻo ia hoʻi i nā Hebera, ua hoʻomana nā Karistiano mua iā Kristo ma ke ʻano he keiki na ka Makua. No laila, ua neʻe loa lākou i kahi ʻaoʻao ʻē aʻe, a me he mea lā iaʻu ... ʻaʻole lākou i launa me ke Kauoha Hou.
ʻEnelani: Ua hele lākou i kahi mamao e like me ka pule i hala iho nei ʻO Kekemapa hoʻopaʻa haʻawina, aia kahi ʻōlelo ʻaʻole pono mākou e aloha liʻiliʻi iā Kristo ʻaʻole pono mākou e aloha nui iā ia. He aha ka ʻōlelo lapuwale loa e hana ai; akā hōʻike ia pehea lākou i haʻalele ai iā Kristo i kekahi ʻano kūlana hoʻohālikelike ma mua o kona kūlana maoli. A maopopo iā ʻoe a me wau he akua ia. No laila, ʻo ka manaʻo ʻaʻole ia he akua a ʻaʻole no ke ʻano o ke Akua, ʻaʻole ia he mea a mākou e hōʻole ai, akā aia kekahi ʻokoʻa ma waena o ke akua a me ke Akua ponoʻī, a ke manaʻo nei wau hiki i kēlā Palapala Hemolele pili i kēia manawa o John 1: 1. No laila makemake ʻoe e kamaʻilio i kēlā me mākou?
Jim: ʻAe, makemake wau. He mea nui kēia o ka Palapala ʻo Trinitori a he palapala nui no hoʻi ʻo ka Trinitarian. A inā ʻoe e nānā i ka unuhi Baibala, he nui nā mea i kapa iā Iesū he Akua a ʻo kekahi ʻē aʻe ... nāna i ʻōlelo iā ia he Akua, a ʻo ke Palapala Hemolele kekahi, ma ka ʻōlelo Helene ʻo ia: En archē ēn ho Logos kai ho Logos ēn pros ton Theon kai Theos ēn ho Logos. A hiki iaʻu ke hāʻawi iā ʻoe i kaʻu unuhi ponoʻī o ia mea, ke manaʻo nei wau penei: “i ka hoʻomaka ʻana ʻo Logos-ʻo ka ʻōlelo, ʻo ia hoʻi, no ka mea, ua manaʻo ʻo Logos i waena o nā mea ʻē aʻe - a ʻo ka Logos e kū nei i ke Akua a me ke Akua he akua he huaʻōlelo ".
No ke aha wau e unuhi i kēia e ke alo o ka Logos i ke Akua? Ka, ma mua o ko Logos me ke Akua? ʻEā, no ka mākaukau o ka ʻōlelo ma kēia hihia. maikaʻi, ma Koine Greek pono ʻole ka mea pololei me ka "me" e hana ai i ka ʻōlelo Pelekania, kahi e loaʻa ai iā ʻoe ka manaʻo o "along with" a i ʻole "i ka hui pū ʻana me". Akā ke ʻano o ka huaʻōlelo i ka mea i emi iho ma mua o kēlā, a i ʻole ʻoi aku paha ma mua o kēlā.
A ʻo Helen Barrett Montgomery i kāna unuhi o John 1 a 3, a ke heluhelu nei wau i kekahi o kēia, kākau ʻo ia: "I ka maka mua ka huaʻōlelo a he alo ke alo ka maka o ka huaʻōlelo me ke Akua aʻo ka Logou ke Akua."
Aia kēlā mea he mea makemake ʻole. Pros ke ʻano o ka maka a he alo a i ʻole ke kaʻawale mai ke Akua a hōʻike i ka ʻoiaʻiʻo aia he 2 mau kānaka ma laila ʻaʻole like o ka mea like a e komo wau i kēlā ma hope.
A ʻo ka mea hoihoi, he paʻi kēia, a i ʻole lilo ia i paʻi o ka American Baptist publication Society, no laila ke holo nei ʻo ia ma ke ʻano he Trinitari. A pēlā ʻo Charles B. Williams, a iā ia ka huaʻōlelo a i ʻole ka Logos e ʻōlelo ana he alo a he alo me ke Akua a like me ia, maopopo leʻa ʻo ia, akaka wale nō he Trinitary ʻo ia. Ua hāʻawi ʻia kahi unuhi pilikino i ka ʻōlelo a ka poʻe ma 1949 i ka Moody Bible Institute no ka paʻi ʻana, a ʻo ia mau poʻe he poʻe Tritarians lākou. No laila ua loaʻa iā mākou nā ʻano unuhi āpau ma ka ʻōlelo Pelekania a me nā ʻōlelo ʻē aʻe, ʻo ia hoʻi ka Kelemania, ʻo ia hoʻi… e ʻōlelo, ʻeā, "ʻo ke Akua ka Logou", a e like me ka ʻōlelo a ka poʻe he nui, "a he Akua ka ʻōlelo" aiʻole "akua ka ʻōlelo".
Ua hopohopo ka nui o nā ʻepekema a ʻo ke kumu o kēia ma ka ʻōlelo Helene ke lawe kekahi huaʻōlelo i ka ʻatikala paʻa, a ʻo ka ʻatikala paʻa i ka ʻōlelo Pelekania ʻo "the", a no laila mākou e ʻōlelo nei "ke akua", akā i ka Helene, aia ʻaʻohe "akua" ma ke ʻano maoli. A me ke ʻano o kā lākou lawelawe ʻana i kēia…
Eric: ʻAʻohe palapala pili ʻole.
Jim: Pololei kēlā, a ʻo ke ʻano o kā lākou lawelawe ʻana i kēia, ʻaʻohe huaʻōlelo no ka ʻatikala palena ʻole e like me “a” a i ʻole “an” ma ka ʻōlelo Pelekania a pinepine, ke ʻike ʻoe i kahi inoa me ka ʻole o kahi ʻatikala, me ka ʻole o ka ʻatikala paʻa, manaʻo ʻoe i loko o ka unuhi Pelekane, pono ʻole ia ma mua o ka paʻa. No laila ke ʻōlelo "ka Logos" ma mua ma ka Palapala Hemolele me kahi ʻatikala paʻa akā akā hoʻomau ʻia e ʻōlelo ʻo ke Logos ke Akua, a laila ʻaʻohe ʻatikala paʻa i mua o kēlā huaʻōlelo, "akua", a pēlā ʻoe hiki iā ʻoe ke manaʻo mai ia mea ma kahi o ka ʻoiaʻiʻo, pono ʻoe e unuhi i kēia paukū he "Akua" ma mua o "ke Akua". A he nui nā unuhi i hana i kēlā, akā pono e akahele kekahi. Pono e akahele kekahi. ʻAʻole hiki iā ʻoe ke ʻōlelo i kēlā dogmatically no ka mea ua hōʻike nā grammarans he nui nā manawa kahi definite mau ka definite. A hoʻomau kēia hoʻopaʻapaʻa ad absurdum. A inā he Trinitary ʻoe, e kuʻi ʻoe i ka pākaukau a ʻōlelo, "ʻĀ, he mea maopopo ia ke kapa ʻia ka Logos he Akua, no laila ʻo ia kekahi o nā mea ʻekolu o ke Trinity, a no laila ʻo ia ke Akua. ” Wahi a kekahi poʻe, "ʻAʻole loa".
ʻĀ, inā ʻoe e nānā i nā palapala a Origin, ʻo wai kekahi o nā loea Karistiano mua loa, ua laina ʻo ia me ka poʻe i ʻōlelo, "pololei ke akua", a e kākoʻo ʻo ia i ka ʻO ka unuhi a ka hōʻike a Iēhova ma kahi a lākou e loaʻa ai he "Akua ka ʻōlelo"
ʻEnelani: Akau.
Jim: a… akā ʻaʻole hiki iā mākou ke dogmatic e pili ana i kēlā. He mea hiki ʻole ia i ka dogmatic e pili ana iā ia, a inā ʻoe e nānā i ka poʻe Unitarians ma kekahi ʻaoʻao a me nā poʻe Trinitarians ma kekahi ʻaoʻao, e hakakā lākou no kēia a hōʻike i nā ʻano paio āpau, a hoʻomau nā hoʻopaʻapaʻa ad absurdum. A haʻohaʻo ʻoe e pili ana i nā ʻaoʻao like ʻole: Inā pololei ka postmodernists ke ʻōlelo lākou, "ʻAe, ʻo ka mea a ka mea heluhelu e lawe ai i kahi palapala i kākau ʻia ma mua o ka mea a ka mea nāna i kākau ka palapala i manaʻo ai". ʻĀ, ʻaʻole hiki iā mākou ke hele i kahi mamao.
Akā makemake wau, e ʻōlelo wau i kēlā manawa me ka hoʻopaʻapaʻa ʻana i ke ʻano grammatical o kēia ʻōlelo i John 1: 1-3, ʻoi aku ka maikaʻi o ke noi ʻana i kahi ala ʻē aʻe o ke aʻo ʻana i kēia mea āpau, a ke manaʻo nei wau no ka mea ua hele mai wau i kēia mau mea ma ka ke kumu o kaʻu hoʻomaʻamaʻa aʻo ponoʻī. He mōʻaukala kumu wau; ʻo kaʻu PhD i ka mōʻaukala. ʻOiai he keiki liʻiliʻi wau i ka hoʻomana haipule i kēlā manawa a ua lilo wau i manawa nui i ke aʻo ʻana ʻaʻole hoʻokahi hoʻomana, akā nui nā hoʻomana, a me nā Palapala Hemolele. akā e hoʻopaʻapaʻa wau ʻo ke ala e hoʻokokoke ai i kēia ka mōʻaukala.
ʻEnelani: Akau.
Jim: Ke kau nei i kēia mau palapala palapala, i kēia mau kumuhana i ka mea e pili ana i ka makahiki 1st, i ke ola ʻana ʻo Iesū Kristo a ma hope iho o kona make ʻana; a o ka mea oiaio o keia ko ke ao nei o ka Trinity, aole i hiki i keia, a piha paha aole i puhi piha, i na makahiki mahope mai o ko Kristo make ana, a ike ka poe ike i keia mau la. A he helu kikowaena o nā helu Katolika maikaʻi, ua ʻike ʻia he mau ʻoihana Katolika kaulana i kēia.
ʻEnelani: No laila…
Jim: Manaʻo wau he mea kupaianaha ia.
ʻEnelani: No laila, ma mua o ka neʻe ʻana i loko o kēlā mea - no ka mea ʻo ia ka mea nui o kēia wikiō, ka mōʻaukala - e hoʻomaʻamaʻa wale no nā poʻe āpau e uluhua i ka John 1: 1 kūkākūkā, manaʻo wau he loina i ʻae ʻia i waena o ka poʻe e aʻo ana ka Baibala exegetically inā aia kekahi ala i kahi kānalua, i hiki ke lawe kūpono ʻia i kekahi ala a i ʻole ʻē aʻe, a laila ʻaʻole hiki i kēlā ala ke lilo i mea hōʻoia akā hiki ke lilo i mea kākoʻo, ke hoʻokumu ʻia kahi hōʻoia paʻa ma kahi ʻē aʻe.
No laila, Kākoʻo ʻo John 1: 1 i ke aʻo Trinity, inā hiki iā ʻoe ke hōʻoia i ke Trinity i kahi ʻē aʻe. Kākoʻo ia i ka ʻike henotheistic, inā hiki iā mākou ke hōʻike i kahi ʻē aʻe. ʻO ia kā mākou e hana ai… ʻeā, lawe mākou i ʻekolu mau hana. ʻO kēia kahi ʻāpana 1. E loaʻa paha iā mākou he 2 mau wikiō hou aku. E nānā kekahi i nā huaʻōlelo hōʻoia e hoʻohana ai ʻo Trinitary; e nānā ana kekahi i nā ʻōlelo hōʻoiaʻiʻo a Aryans i hoʻohana ai, akā i kēia manawa manaʻo wau he ala waiwai nui ka mōʻaukala e hoʻokumu i ke kahua a i ʻole ka nele o ke aʻo Trinity. No laila, e waiho wau i ka papahele iā ʻoe.
Jim: E maikaʻi loa kāua. Manaʻo wau he mea maopopo loa ʻaʻohe aʻo o ke Trinity i nā kenekulia ʻelua, ʻaʻole i ke ʻano ma ka liʻiliʻi loa e kū nei i kēia lā. ʻAʻole i hiki mai ka Trinitaryism ma ka ʻAha Kūkā o Nicaea i ka makahiki 325 AD e like me ka makemake o nā poʻe Tritarians. ʻO ka mea maoli, ʻo ka mea i loaʻa iā mākou ma Nicaea ka ʻae ʻia o ke aʻo a ...
ʻEnelani: Hoʻolua
Jim: ʻAe, 2 mau kānaka ma mua o 3. A ʻo ke kumu o kēia ka mea i hopohopo nui e pili ana i ka pilina o ka makuakāne a me ke keiki. ʻAʻole i ʻōlelo ʻia ka ʻUhane Hemolele i kēia manawa, a no laila ua aʻo ʻia kahi aʻo binatarian ma laila, ʻaʻole kahi Trinitary, a ua hōʻea lākou i kēia ma o ka hoʻohana ʻana i kahi huaʻōlelo, "hamaucious", ʻo ia hoʻi ka like waiwai, a ua hoʻopaʻapaʻa lākou he like ka makuakāne a me ke keikikāne.
I kēia manawa ua hoʻolauna ʻia kēia e ka Emepera Constantine, a he hapa Karistiano wale nō ia, inā ʻoe e ʻōlelo pēlā. ʻAʻole ʻo ia i bapetizo ʻia a hiki i kona wā e kokoke ai e make. A ua hana ʻo ia i nā hewa koʻikoʻi he nui, akā ua lilo ʻo ia i mea maikaʻi i ka hoʻomana Kalikiano, akā makemake ʻo ia e hoʻonohonoho pono ia, a no laila hoʻoholo ʻo ia e hoʻopau ʻo ia i nā paio e hana nei. A hoʻolauna ʻo ia i kēia huaʻōlelo a ua lilo kēia i mea e hōʻoluʻolu ai i ka ʻaoʻao Trinitary a i ʻole ka pāʻina binatarian e like me lākou i kēlā manawa, no ka mea makemake lākou e haʻi iā Arius, ʻo ia ka mea makemake ʻole e ʻae i kēia manaʻo, he heretic. A ʻo kēia wale nō ke ala e hiki ai iā lākou ke haʻi iā ia he heretic. A no laila ua hoʻolauna lākou i kēia huaʻōlelo i lilo i ʻāpana o ka hoʻomana Katolika mai ia manawa mai ka maka o hoʻokahi ʻaoʻao.
No laila, lohi loa ke Trinity. Ua hele mai ma hope nui loa i ka wā a lākou i hoʻolaha ai ka ʻUhane Hemolele i lilo i 3 kanaka o ke Kahikolu. A ʻo 381 kēlā.
ʻEnelani: A ua pili paha kahi Emepera ʻē aʻe a ʻo ia nō paha?
Jim: Pololei kēnā. ʻO Theodosius ka Nui.
ʻEnelani: No laila, ʻaʻole ia i pāpā aku i ka paganism wale nō akā i pāpā ʻia e ʻoe ka Arianism a i ʻole kekahi poʻe Trinitarian ... no laila, kūʻē i ke kānāwai ke manaʻoʻiʻo ʻaʻole ke Akua Kahikolu.
Jim: Pololei, pololei kēlā. Ua lilo i kānāwai ʻole he pagan a i ʻole he Kristiano Arian a ua pāpā ʻia a hoʻomāinoino ʻia kēia mau kūlana āpau, ʻoiai ʻo Arianism i waiho i waho o nā holoholona o nā ʻohana Kelemania no ka mea ʻo ka poʻe Arian nāna i hoʻouna i nā mikionali e hoʻohuli i ka hapa nui o nā ʻohana Kelemania ka lanakila ʻana ma ka ʻaoʻao komohana o ʻEulopa a me ka ʻaoʻao komohana o ka Emepaea Roma.
ʻEnelani: Pololei, no laila e ʻae iaʻu e hoʻopololei, loaʻa iā ʻoe kahi manaʻo i hōʻike ʻole ʻia ma ka Palapala Hemolele a mai nā moʻolelo mōʻaukala i ʻike ʻike ʻole ʻia i ka Kalikiano ʻekahi a me ka ʻelua. komo i loko o kahi paio ma ka hale pule; ua hoʻomalu ʻia e ka mōʻī pagan ʻaʻole i bapetizo ʻia i kēlā manawa; a laila he poʻe Kalikiano kāu i manaʻoʻiʻo ʻole, hoʻomaʻau ʻo ia; a manaʻoʻiʻo mākou ʻaʻole i hoʻohana ke Akua iā Iesū Kristo a me nā lunaʻōlelo e hōʻike i kēia akā ua hoʻohana i kahi emepera pagan nāna e hoʻomaʻau i ka poʻe i kūlike ʻole.
Jim: Pololei kēlā, ʻoiai ma hope mai ua hoʻi ʻo ia, huli ʻo ia a hina i lalo o ka mana o kahi Pīhopa Arian a bapetizo ʻia ʻo ia e ka poʻe Arian ma mua o ka poʻe Trinitarians.
ʻEnelani: Okoa. ʻO ka mea kau he nane.
Jim: ʻĀ, ke hele mākou i loko o kēia mamao, ʻike ʻoe i ka ʻaneʻane o nā hoʻoholo āpau i hoʻoholo ʻia i loko o nā ʻaha kūkāʻōlelo i hana ʻia me ke kākoʻo o nā luna o ka honua, nā ʻemepela Roma, a ʻo ka mea hope loa ua hoʻoholo nui ʻia kekahi o lākou e kekahi o nā pope, a ua pili i ka nīnau o ka mea i hana ʻia ai ʻo Kristo, ka mea e ʻike ʻia a hoʻomana ʻia ma ke ʻano he Akua a he kanaka holoʻokoʻa hoʻi.
No laila, ʻaʻole i hanaʻia ka manaʻo o ke aʻo ʻana e kekahi hui pule e hui pū ʻia ana. Hana ia na mea i hiki mai he hui hui hui a hui ʻole ʻia paha kahi hale pule i lalo o nā hanana aupuni.
ʻEnelani: Pololei, mahalo. No laila, e ʻano hōʻuluʻulu wale i kā mākou kūkākūkā i kēia lā, ke nānā nei wau i kahi wikiō o kahi Trinitary e wehewehe nei i ke aʻo ʻana, a ua ʻae ʻo ia he paʻakikī loa e hoʻomaopopo, akā ua ʻōlelo ʻo ia "he mea ʻole ʻaʻole maopopo iaʻu ia. Ua ʻōlelo akāka ʻia i ka Baibala, no laila pono wau e ʻae i ka hilinaʻi i nā mea i haʻi piha ʻia. ”
Akā mai kāu mea e haʻi mai nei iaʻu, ʻaʻohe hōʻike i loko o ka Baibala, ʻaʻole hoʻi i ka moʻaukala o ka lāhui ʻIseraʻela ma mua o Kristo, a me kekahi kaiāulu o ke Kalikiano a hiki i ke kenekulia 3 o nā hōʻike maopopo o ke Kahikolu.
Jim: Pololei kēlā, pololei kēlā; a ʻaʻohe kākoʻo maopopo iā ia e nā ʻaha kūkā o ka hale pule a hiki i ka makahiki 381. Lohi nani. Lohi maikaʻi. A i ka Middle Ages, he ʻoiaʻiʻo, ua hoʻokaʻawale nā halepule Hikina a me ka halepule Roma Komohana, i kekahi hapa, no nā pilikia e pili ana i ke Trinity. No laila, ʻaʻohe kūlana kūlike i nā mea he nui. Loaʻa iā mākou nā hui e like me nā Kristiano Coptic ma ʻAigupita a me nā Nestorian a pēlā aku a puni ka Middle Ages i ʻae ʻole i kekahi o nā manaʻo o ka ʻaha kūkā hope e pili ana i ke ʻano o Kristo.
ʻEnelani: Akau. Aia kekahi e ʻōlelo, “ʻAe, ʻaʻole ia he mea nui inā ʻoe e hilinaʻi nei ʻaʻole he Trinity. Kūpono mākou a pau iā Kristo. Maikaʻi a pau. ”
Hiki iaʻu ke ʻike i ke kuanaʻike, akā ma ka ʻaoʻao ʻē, ke noʻonoʻo nei wau iā John 17: 3 e ʻōlelo nei ʻo ke kumu o ke ola, ke ola mau loa, e ʻike i ke Akua a e ʻike i ke keiki a ke Akua, ʻo Iesu Kristo, a inā mākou e hoʻomaka nei i kā mākou huakaʻi o ka ʻike ma kahi kahua wahaheʻe, ma kahi kahua nāwaliwali a hewa hoʻi, ʻaʻole mākou e kiʻi i ka mea a mākou e makemake ai e loaʻa. ʻOi aku ka maikaʻi e hoʻomaka mai kahi ʻoiaʻiʻo a hoʻolōʻihi ia.
No laila, ke manaʻo nei wau he mea nui loa kēia ʻike ʻana no ka ʻike ʻana iā Iēhova ke Akua a me Iēhova a i ʻole YHWH, e like me kou makemake e hea iā ia, a me ka ʻike ʻana i kāna keiki ʻo Yeshua a ʻo Jesus paha, he mea nui loa i ka hopena hope mākou i lilo ai i hoʻokahi me ke Akua ma ke kumu a i ka noʻonoʻo a me ka naʻau a lilo i keiki na ke Akua.
Jim: E ʻae ʻoe iaʻu i kēia i ka panina, Eric: Ke kū ʻoe a noʻonoʻo i ka nui o ka poʻe i hala i nā kenekulia i pepehi ʻia e ka poʻe Katolika, Roma Katolika, Greek orthodox, Kalavina Kalikiano, nā mea ukali o John Calvin's the reformed movement, the Lutherans a me nā Anglicans, i loko o nā makahiki i pepehi ʻia nā kānaka he nui loa no ka hōʻole ʻana e ʻae i ke aʻo ʻana o ke Trinity. Kupanaha ia! ʻOiai, ʻo ka hihia i ʻike nui ʻia ʻo ia ke kuni ʻana i ke ahi o Servetus i ke kenekulia 16, no kona hōʻole ʻana i ke Trinity; a ʻoiai ʻaʻole makemake ʻo John Calvin e puhi ʻia ʻo ia i ke ahi, makemake ʻo ia e alakaʻi, a ʻo ka ʻAha Kūkā a i ʻole ka hui o ka honua i hoʻoholo ma Geneva nāna i hoʻoholo e puhi ʻia ʻo ia i ke ahi. A nui nā poʻe ʻē aʻe ... nā Iudaio i koi ʻia e hoʻohuli i ka Katolika ma Sepania a hoʻi hou a hoʻi i ka Iudaio - ʻo kekahi o lākou e hana nei i nā Iudaio a me nā rabi Iudaio - akā no ka pale ʻana iā lākou iho i waho, ua lilo lākou i poʻe kāhuna Katolika, he mea ʻano ʻē maoli nō ia, a ʻo ka hapa nui o kēia poʻe, inā lākou i hopu ʻia, make lākou. He mea weliweli ia. Nā Unitarians inā lākou — he mau ʻano like ʻole o lākou — akā ʻo ka poʻe i hōʻole i ke Trinity, ua hoʻopiʻi ʻia lākou ma ʻEnelani a ua hoʻokapu ʻia a hiki i ka kenekulia 19; a he mau mea ʻepekema poʻokela loa i anti-Trinitarians: John Milton, Sir Isaac Newton, John Locke, a ma hope ma ke kenekulia 19, ua ʻike ke kāne i ʻike i ka oxygen - ua hoʻopau ʻia kona home a me kāna waihona e ka lehulehu a ua holo ʻo ia i ʻAmelika Hui Pū ʻIa kahi i lawe ʻia ai ʻo ia e Thomas Jefferson.
No laila, he mea aʻo āu e aʻo ai nā ʻano kanaka āpau a me nā hana aloha ʻole a nā Trinitarians i hana kolohe. I kēia manawa, ʻaʻole ia e ʻōlelo i ka emi ʻana o kekahi mau Unitarians ma mua o ke Kalikiano i kā lākou ʻano, e like me kā mākou e ʻike nei. Akā ʻo ka ʻoiaʻiʻo, he mea aʻo ia i pale pinepine ʻia e ka lāʻau, e ʻaʻā ana i ka lāʻau. A ʻo kēia ka mea weliweli loa no ka mea ʻo ka ʻoiaʻiʻo ke nānā aku ʻoe i nā poʻe haipule i kēia lā. ʻO ka mea maʻamau e hele nei i ka hale pule, he Katolika paha ia, he Anglican, he mea hele i ka hale pule hou ... he nui, nā mea ʻē aʻe… ʻaʻole maopopo iā lākou, ʻaʻole maopopo ka poʻe i ke aʻo ʻana a he nui nā kahunapule i haʻi iaʻu. ma ka Lāpule Trinity, kahi ʻāpana o ka kalena a ka hale pule, ʻaʻole maopopo iā lākou ka mea e hana ai me ia no ka mea ʻaʻole maopopo iā lākou.
He paʻakikī paʻakikī, aʻoi aku ka paʻakikī e hele a puni i kou poʻo.
ʻEnelani: No laila, lohe wau i ka ʻoiaʻiʻo, ʻaʻole pono mākou e hele ma mua o ka ʻōlelo a Iesū ma Mataio 7 kahi āna i ʻōlelo ai, "Ma kā lākou hana e ʻike ai ʻoe i kēia mau kāne." Hiki iā lākou ke kamaʻilio i kahi kamaʻilio maikaʻi, akā hōʻike kā lākou mau hana i ko lākou ʻuhane maoli. Ke alakaʻi nei kaʻuhane o ke Akua iā lākou e aloha a i ʻole ka ʻuhane o Sātana e alakaʻi iā lākou e inaina? ʻO ia paha ka mea hoʻoholo nui loa no ka poʻe e ʻimi nei i ka ʻike a me ka naʻauao e pili ana i kēia mea.
Jim: ʻAe, ua maikaʻi kā ka mōʻaukala o kēia ʻano aʻo.
ʻEnelani: ʻAe, pēlā nō.
Jim: Loaʻa maoli ia.
ʻEnelani: ʻAe, mahalo nui iā Jim mahalo i kou manawa a ke aloha aku nei au i nā mea a pau no ke nānā ʻana. E hoʻihoʻi hou mākou i ka ʻaoʻao 2 o kēia kikowaena i ka manawa hiki iā mākou ke hoʻokomo i kā mākou noiʻi āpau. No laila, e hoʻomaʻamaʻa au i kēia manawa
Jim: A he ahiahi maikaʻi
Aloha e kala mai no ka ʻōlelo, akā pono wau e hoʻohana i ka mea unuhi. Makemake wau e hoʻomaikaʻi aku iā ʻoe no ka lawe ʻana mai i kēia kumuhana baibala nui e pili ana inā he Trinity ke Akua. Ke aʻo nei au i ke kumuhana o ke Kahikolu no 30 mau makahiki. Ua aʻo koke wau he aʻo baibala ʻole kēia. Ma kahi o 7 mau makahiki i hala aku nei, me kahi manaʻo like, hoʻomaka mākou i kahi blog https://blog.antytrynitaryie.pl/, kahi e hoʻāʻo ai e kōkua i ka poʻe e ʻike i ke Akua wale nō, YHWH a me kāna Keiki, e like me ʻoe. Ma loko o 100 mau komo, kūkākūkā mākou i nā paukū Baibala he nui i kūʻē i ke aʻo a nā... Pākuhi hou »
ʻO kā Jack ʻōlelo hou loa he maikaʻi loa. Makemake wau e kākoʻo i kēia manaʻo me ʻehiku mau kui i loko o ka pahu kupapaʻu o ke kumumanaʻo Trinity. O IESU HE AKUA. O IEHOVA KE AKUA O IESU KRISTO. ʻO ka unuhi ʻana o ka ʻōlelo hemolele: "ʻ saidlelo maila ʻo Iesū iā ia, Ua palapala ʻia nō hoʻi, Mai hoʻowalewale ʻoe i ka Haku i kou Akua." (Mat 4: 7) "A i ka iwa o ka hora, kāhea akula ʻo Iesū me ka leo nui, ʻī akula, ʻEli, ʻEli, lama sabaketani? ʻo ia hoʻi kēia, E kuʻu Akua, e kuʻu Akua, no ke aha ʻoe i haʻalele mai ai iaʻu? (Mat 27:46) "ʻ said maila ʻo Iesū iā ia, No ke aha ʻoe i kapa mai ai iaʻu he maikaʻi? ʻAʻohe mea maikaʻi ʻē aʻe, ʻo ia hoʻi,... Pākuhi hou »
Aloha Frankie (hou), nui nā ʻōlelo i loko o ka palapala hemolele e ʻōlelo nei no ke ʻano kanaka o Iesū, a nui nā palapala hemolele e ʻōlelo e pili ana i kāna akua, pono mākou e nīnau no ke aha kēlā? Ke manaʻoʻiʻo nei ʻoe ʻo Iesū ka mua a me ka hope loa ka merism no ka mau loa? ʻAʻole i luʻu ka poʻe heluhelu o kēia ʻōlelo i ka relatib o ka manawa a i ʻole nā metaphysics e wehewehe ai i kēia. Maopopo iā lākou i kēia ʻōlelo e pili ana he mau loa ʻo Iesū no ka mea ʻo ia ke Akua, ʻaʻohe ona kumu a ʻaʻohe hopena, ʻo ia hoʻi ʻaʻole i hana ʻia ʻo Iesū, a i ʻole pehea mākou e wehewehe ai.... Pākuhi hou »
Ua aʻo anei ʻo Iesū i ka hoʻomana ʻana iā ia iho? Aʻole.
Ua hoʻomana ʻo Iesū i ke Akua Hoʻokahi, kona Makua.
Ua pani ʻia ka hihia.
Uʻi!
Kākoʻo no ka TRINITY DOCTRINE e like me ke kumu o kēia HEADING? ………. Ua kope ʻia mai kahi papaha ʻē aʻe. Ke hele nei kēia moʻo i ke kiko hiki ke kiʻi ʻia e kūʻē i kēia aʻo ʻana # 1 HELU O KE AKUA maopopo leʻa i ke kaʻina, ʻo ke Akua wale nō ka mea i hiki ke "Mua a me ka hope / hoʻomaka a me ka hoʻopau / Alpha a me Omega" i ka manawa like no ka mea ua ola ʻo ia ma mua o nā mea i hana ʻia āpau a ʻo ia wale nō ka mea e koe ke hoʻoholo ʻo ia e hoʻopau i nā ola āpau. ʻO ka Simelikeous "ʻO ka mua a me ka hope" kahi helu wale nō i loaʻa ʻole i ka Uncreated. 2 LUNAKANAWAI O KE AKUA Ua ike makou o YAHWEH, ka... Pākuhi hou »
E kāua i hoʻokahi mea i ka manawa: # 1 HELU O KE AKUA ʻAʻohe mea e like me ka mea mua ke ʻole he kekona. Pono ke kaʻina i ka manawa no ka mea aia kahi mua a me ka hope. No laila ʻo ke Akua ka mua He aha? ʻAʻole ka mea i hana mua ʻia. Pela i ka mea? Aia ke Akua ma waho o ka manawa. ʻO Iesū ka mea nāna lākou e hana ai, nā mea nāna, a nāna e hana nā mea āpau, a me ka manawa pū kekahi. No laila ʻo Iesū (ʻo ke Akua paha ia a i ʻole ke akua hānau ʻokoʻa, ʻokoʻa i ke Akua ka Makua) ma waho o ka manawa a no laila ma mua o ka manawa. ʻO wau... Pākuhi hou »
ʻIke mākou mai ka ʻepekema hiki ke loli ka manawa. ʻIke mākou ʻo ka wikiwiki i ka holomua e pili ana i ka wikiwiki o kahi mea e neʻe ai i ke kokoke i ka wikiwiki o ke kukui. Mai kēia mea, e ʻike ʻia ka manawa a me ka manawa kahi o ka hana. ʻIke mākou ʻaʻole kuleana ke Akua i kekahi mea e hoʻopili ana i ka manawa.
ʻO kaʻu hopena kēia e pili ana i nā hōʻike i mua oʻu. Hiki iā ʻoe ke loaʻa kahi ʻokoʻa ʻokoʻa a ʻoluʻolu loa ʻoe iā ia, ʻoiaʻiʻo.
ʻAe e Eric, pololei ʻoe. Hana ʻia ke ao holoʻokoʻa i ka manawa-manawa - Minkowski's 4-dimensional space: x1, x2, x3, and c (for time). ʻO kahi laʻana, ʻaʻole mau ka manawa ma waena o nā hanana ʻelua ma waena o nā mea nānā, akā pili i nā wikiwiki i waena o kā lākou mau papa kuhikuhi (Lorentz transformation - ʻehā kaulike i hoʻohana ʻia e helu hou i nā kikowaena o ka hakahaka a me ka manawa i ka hoʻololi ma waena o nā ʻōnaehana hoʻohui inertial). Hoʻohui, aia ka dilation (hoʻolōʻihi) o ka manawa. Wahi a ke kumumanaʻo o ka hilinaʻi, ʻo ka dilation o ka manawa kahi waiwai o ka manawa ponoʻī, no laila me ka piʻi wikiwiki ʻana ʻaʻole wale ka lohi o ka uaki e neʻe... Pākuhi hou »
Eia kekahi mau hōʻoia e hiki ke hoʻololi i ka manawa: https://www.s Scientificamerican.com/article/einsteins-time-dilation-prediction-verified/#:~:text=Physicists%20have%20verified%20a%20key,than%20for % 20a% 20stationary% 20one. & Huaʻōlelo = Kakaikahi% 20 ʻepekema% 20 kānalua% 20a% 20Einstein% 20ma% 20 pono. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hafele%E2 %80 %93 Keating_experiment Ke hōʻoia nei kēia ʻaʻole "ʻano" ke ʻano o ka holo ʻana o ka manawa ma muli o ka wikiwiki, akā ʻokoʻa maoli nō, a e like me nā waiwai i wānana ʻia e ka manaʻo o Einstein. . Eia kekahi, ʻo ka manaʻo ʻaʻole hiki i ke Akua ke hoʻopunipuni ke hoʻokumu i kuʻu manaʻo ma mua o ka lanakila ʻana iā ia. ʻO ka wahaheʻe e hoʻokau iā ia iho i kekahi mea. Ke wahaheʻe mākou, hana hewa mākou a lilo i kauā na ka hewa. ʻAʻole hiki ke Akua i lalo o kekahi mea, ʻaʻole ke kauā i kekahi mea, akā ʻo nā mea āpau i lalo iā ia. ". . .No ka mea, "kau ʻo ke Akua i nā mea āpau ma lalo o kona mau wāwae." Akā iā ia... Pākuhi hou »
Ua hāʻawi wau iā ʻoe i ʻelua mau kūmole i nā hoʻokolohua ʻepekema e kākoʻo ana i kekahi o kaʻu mau kuhi nui, akā nānā ʻole ʻoe iā lākou, a ʻōlelo i ka mea aʻu i ʻōlelo ai ʻaʻole he ʻoiaʻiʻo. Eia hou, hoʻopiʻi ʻoe iaʻu no ka hoʻomaka ʻana i kahi hoʻomana. Ke hana nei ʻoe ma ke kahua no ka mea ʻaʻole hiki iā ʻoe ke noʻonoʻo i kekahi mea ma mua o ka hoʻokumu ʻana o ka manawa, a laila ʻaʻohe mea i hiki ke ola. Akā hoʻolālā ʻoe ʻo wau ka mea dogmatic. Makemake wau e kūkākūkā i nā manaʻo like ʻole, akā inā ʻoe e pilikino a hoʻopiʻi, a laila hoʻomaha ia i ka leʻaleʻa.
ʻO Eric No ke aha e hoʻonele ai i ka manawa me nā hoʻopaʻapaʻa caustic o Asking wale nō, lawa paha ia e hoʻokipa ʻia ai e kamaʻilio ma aneʻi ʻoiai he ʻano lōʻihi kāna e kāhea aku nei iā ʻoe ma kēia kolamu. (ʻoi aku kou ahonui ma mua o ka hapanui) Manaʻo wau ʻaʻole hiki iā ia ke kōkua iā ia iho ʻoiai ʻo ia nō kāna, ʻaʻole ʻike ʻia iā mākou, papahana. ʻLelo wau ua hoʻololi ʻo ia i kāna avatar iā Just Arguing, no ka mea inā manaʻo ʻo ia e hana ana ʻoe i nā mea āna e hoʻopiʻi ai iā ʻoe, no ke aha ʻo ia e hoʻomau mau ai ma aneʻi? Manaʻo wau he nui ka poʻe i kipa aku i kēia kolamu ma nā makahiki a kūʻē ʻē ʻole... Pākuhi hou »
Ua ʻōlelo ʻo Iesū i nā mea āpau e pili pū ana i kāna mau loiloi.
ʻO ka hale kiaʻi kēia e hana ʻē aʻe.
Mahalo wau i kā Eric mau hana mau e hoʻomau i ka wehe ʻana i nā laina o ke kamaʻilio me ka poʻe kūlike ʻole.
Mahalo iā ʻolua. Hiki iaʻu ke ʻike i nā ʻaoʻao ʻelua o ke kūkā. ʻLelo aku ʻo Paulo iā Timoteo: ʻ Ilelo hou wau, mai komo i loko o nā hoʻopaʻapaʻa lapuwale a naʻaupō e hoʻomaka ai ka hakakā. ʻAʻole pono e hakakā ke kauā a ka Haku akā pono e lokomaikaʻi i nā mea āpau, hiki ke aʻo, a hoʻomanawanui i ka poʻe paʻakikī. E aʻo mālie i ka poʻe e kūʻē i ka ʻoiaʻiʻo. E hoʻololi paha ke Akua i ka naʻau o kēlā poʻe, a e aʻo lākou i ka ʻoiaʻiʻo. A laila e noʻonoʻo lākou a pakele mai ka hei a ka diabolō. No ka mea, ua paʻa lākou iā ia e hana i kāna makemake. (2 Timoteo... Pākuhi hou »
Le problème nʻest pas dʻaccepter ou pas un avis contraire. Kūpono ʻo Eric accepte lʻexposition dʻavis. Le problème cʻest le TON de JA. Ses propos sont acerbes, autoritaires et manquent de respect. Nā manaʻo hoʻopiʻi me nā FAUSSES. Personne sur ce site, et sûrement pas Eric, a le désir de créer he haipule. Je pense que cʻest JA qui doit revoir sa façon de parler qui me choque. Nous sommes des chrétiens, conduisons nous en chrétiens remplis dʻamour et de sollicitude. No ka mea, ua hana au i ka hana ma mua o nā huaʻōlelo a me nā kolamu 4: 6 [6] Que votre parole... Pākuhi hou »
ʻAʻole wau i pili i ka hoʻohuli ʻana i kekahi, ʻaʻole ʻo Iesū.
Pehea wau e ʻike ai i ka mea a ke Akua e hana nei i loko o ka puʻuwai o ke kāne? A i ʻole pehea e hoʻonui ai ka manaʻo o kekahi kanaka i kaʻu iho?
I kēia ala mālama wau i koʻu puʻuwai ponoʻī mai ka hoʻopunipuni iaʻu i ka manaʻo hiki iaʻu ke hoʻokolokolo i kahi kāne. Aʻole hiki iaʻu.
Pono mākou e kahakiʻi i ka laina ma kahi, akā pono kēlā me kēia o mākou e hoʻoholo i kahi e huki ai. 2 John 6-11 e akāka ai he mau palena no ko mākou makemake e hoʻolohe i kekahi. ʻOiai ʻo Iesū i hōʻike i ka huhū i kekahi manawa me ka poʻe paʻakikī. "No laila hoʻomaka lākou e ʻōlelo iā ia: ʻO wai ʻoe?" ʻ akula ʻo Iesū iā lākou, No ke aha lā wau e ʻōlelo aku nei iā ʻoukou? Nui kaʻu mau mea e kamaʻilio ai e pili ana iā ʻoe a e hoʻokolokolo ai. ʻOiai he mea ʻoiaʻiʻo, ʻo ka mea nāna au i hoʻouna mai he ʻoiaʻiʻo, a ʻo nā mea aʻu i lohe ai iā ia ʻo wau nō... Pākuhi hou »
(Ioane 8: 25-30) 25 No laila lākou i nīnau ai iā ia, ʻO wai ʻoe? ʻ akula ʻo Iesū iā lākou, No ke aha lā wau e ʻōlelo aku nei iā ʻoukou? 26 He nui kaʻu mau mea e olelo aku ai no oukou, a e hoohewa aku ai. He ʻoiaʻiʻo, ʻo ka mea nāna au i hoʻouna mai he ʻoiaʻiʻo, a ʻo nā mea aʻu i lohe ai iā ia e ʻōlelo nei i ka honua. 27 Aole lakou i ike ua olelo mai ia ia lakou no ka Makua. 28 No laila ʻī maila ʻo Iesū, Aia hāpai aʻe ʻoukou i ke Keiki a ke kanaka, a laila e ʻike ʻoukou, ʻo wau nō ia, a ʻo wau nō.... Pākuhi hou »
ʻOiaʻiʻo, akā ke hoʻohana nei wau i kēlā ʻōlelo ʻōlelo e hōʻike ai i kona huhū. E hāhai i ke kūpili āu e hōʻike ai, hiki iā mākou ke hoʻomau i kahi kamaʻilio me ka poʻe naʻau paʻakikī a kūpono ʻole hoʻi no ka maikaʻi o nā poʻe ʻē aʻe e hoʻolohe ana a hiki ke ʻike i nā ʻaoʻao ʻelua o ke kūkā kamaʻilio. Eia nō naʻe, pehea mākou e hoʻolohe ai i kā Paul ʻōlelo aʻoaʻo e hōʻalo ai i nā hoʻopaʻapaʻa lapuwale a naʻaupō? He aha kou mau manaʻo ma luna o kēlā?
Akā, ʻaʻole ʻoe e kāhea ʻia ʻo Rabi, no ka mea, iā ʻoe nō hoʻokahi Kumu, a he poʻe hoahānau ʻolua āpau. " NIV
ʻAʻole maopopo iaʻu kou manaʻo.
ʻO Kristo wale nō kaʻu Kumu.
Loaʻa wau i kēlā, akā he aha ke kiko i kūlike me ke kumuhana e kūkākūkā ʻia? Ke kūkākūkā nei mākou pehea e hana ai i nā ʻōlelo i hiki ke hele i ka mea a Paul i kapa ai he "nīnau lapuwale a naʻaupō".
No ka mea inā ʻaʻole aʻo ʻo Kristo iā ia ʻaʻole wau e ukali iā ia.
ʻAʻole anei kēia ka mea a Kristo i aʻo ai?
Pili nā mea āpau i hewa me nā hoʻomana Karistiano i kā lākou haʻalele ʻana i nā aʻo a Kristo.
ʻAʻole ke aloha i ka hoalauna, ke aloha i ke kaikaina, i ka ʻai ʻole ʻana me ke kāne. Kekahi mea a Iesu iho i hana ʻole ai.
Noho ʻo Iesū ma ka papa ʻaina me kona poʻe ʻenemi.
E hāhai kākou i ke Keiki a ke Akua!
Pololei anei wau i ka hoʻomaopopo ʻana i kāu e ʻōlelo nei ʻaʻole ʻoe e ʻae i nā ʻōlelo a Paul, no ka mea ʻaʻole mai Iesu mai pololei?
Ke kūʻē ʻo Paulo iā Kristo hele wau ma muli o Kristo.
ʻAʻole wau i ʻike ʻaʻole ʻoe e ʻae i nā Palapala Hemolele āpau. Ma hea ʻo Paulo i kūʻē ai iā Kristo?
ʻAʻole ʻo Kristo i aʻo mai mai ʻai pū me nā hoahānau hewa.
"Ke palapala aku nei au iā ʻoe, mai hui pū me nā mea e ʻōlelo ana he kaikuaʻana a he kaikuahine paha ʻoe, akā, he moekolohe a kolohe paha ia, he hoʻomana kiʻi a mea hoʻomāʻewaʻewa paha, ʻona a ʻonā. Mai ʻai pū me kēlā poʻe. ” NIV
Ua ʻai pū ʻo Iesū me nā lawehala.
He nani ʻo Kristo i kēlā manawa a i kēia manawa.
Mai hoʻokuʻu iā mākou.
Mālama mākou i ko mākou kūpaʻa akā ʻaʻole mākou e kāpae i ko mākou hoa kanaka.
I ʻike ʻo ia iā Kristo a hele mai i ona lā ..
ʻOiaʻiʻo, ua kī wau i kahi wikiō ma kēia kumuhana. E waiho wau i kēia kūkā a hiki i ka puka ʻana i waho a hiki iā ʻoe ke haʻi iaʻu inā ʻoe e ʻae a ʻaʻole paha. Eia naʻe, ʻaʻole au e ʻaelike me ka hōʻole ʻana i nā ʻāpana o ka Baibala. Ua kauoha ʻia ʻo Paulo e Iesū e like me Ioane. ʻO nā ʻōlelo a Iesū āu e aloha nui ai, ʻaʻole i kākau ʻia e Iesū, akā na nā kāne ʻehā, ʻo John kekahi, a ʻo Ioane kekahi i hōʻike ʻia mai iā Iesū, a ua haʻi mai ʻo John iā mākou e pili ʻole i ka mea nāna e lawe mai i kahi ʻano aʻo ʻokoʻa. 2 Ioane 7-11, no laila pono mākou e kāpae.... Pākuhi hou »
Mahalo wau i kou mau manaʻo a me kou mau manaʻo.
Jack
A ʻo wau nō, ʻo ia nō.
Maopopo iaʻu.
E hua mai nā mea āu e manaʻo ai iā Kristo.
Jack
ʻO ka hānai ʻana i ka poʻe ʻilihune, kōkua i ka poʻe home ʻole, e paipai ana i ka poʻe nalowale a hoʻoliʻiliʻi, e hāʻawi ana i ka lima kōkua i ka poʻe nele a me ka poʻe ʻilihune.
ʻO kēia kā mākou kuleana Kalikiano me ka hoʻolaha ʻana i ka Nūhou maikaʻi.
He ʻāpana maoli ia, akā ʻo kā mākou kuleana e hoʻolohe i ke Akua, ʻoiai inā ʻike mākou he mea maikaʻi ʻole ia e hana. ʻAʻole ʻoe e ʻae?
ʻAe loa!
Aia paha kahi ma aneʻi no ka mea e ukali iā Kristo wale nō?
Mai makemake e lawe i ka hakakā.
Aloha Jack, hana ʻoe i kekahi mau manaʻo maikaʻi, akā ʻaʻole wau e ʻōlelo ana e oki ʻia ʻo JA. Ua ʻike ʻo Iesū i ka manawa e "noho hāmau" Mat.26: 63 a ʻo koʻu manaʻo iā Eric, ʻaʻole pono ʻo ia e pono e pane i nā pilikia a JA e loaʻa mau ana, ʻoiai ʻo mākou ʻo Iesū i hiki i kona palena me nā Parisaio. Ma ka ʻaoʻao ʻē aʻe pono ʻo JA e noi i ka 1 Petero 3:15 ke nīnau ʻia e pili ana i kāna mau manaʻoʻiʻo e pane ana "me ke akahai a me ka mahalo nui" I ka hoʻohālikelike ʻana i ka Menekona, ʻaʻohe mea, e like me kā mākou e ʻike nei i kēia ʻano hāmama kamailio makemake... Pākuhi hou »
Aia kekahi hanana i ʻike ʻia ʻo ka Internet Troll. ʻO ke kumu, hoʻohana kekahi poʻe i ka anonymity pili o ka Pūnaewele ma ke ʻano he makapō no ka ʻōlelo ʻana i nā mea a lākou e ʻōlelo ʻole ai ma kahi haʻahaʻa inoa ʻole. Ma nā mea maikaʻi loa, hiki i kēia ke lilo i mea hōʻoki loa a alakaʻi i ka poʻe e haʻalele ana i ka inaina. I ka manawa aʻu i kau mua ai ma aneʻi, aia kekahi i koho iā lākou iho e "hoʻoponopono" i nā mea āpau aʻu i ʻōlelo ai. ʻAʻole wau i pane, ʻo ia ka hopena ʻoi loa i ka trolling. ʻO wai kahi troll, ʻoi aku ka nui o ka nīnau hāmama. Once ke kāne troll paha kekahi kanaka o ka meʻe. He mea mākou... Pākuhi hou »
Aloha Eric. Manaʻo wau he manaʻo paʻakikī loa ka manaʻo o ka manawa a ʻaʻohe manawa paha no ka hapa nui e hoʻomaopopo. Ke hakakā nei wau me ia, ʻaʻole maoli i loaʻa. Ma laila mai paha ʻo JA e hele mai ai. ʻOiai ua hoʻokō ʻia nā hoʻokolohua e hōʻoia i kahi kiko, manaʻo wau he manaʻo paʻakikī loa kēia, e like me ka ʻike ʻana i ka wā e hiki mai ana he manaʻo nō ia, a manaʻo wau ʻaʻole hiki. ʻOiaʻiʻo, inā hiki iā ʻoe ke hele wikiwiki ma mua o ka wikiwiki o ke kukui, hiki iā ʻoe ke alakaʻi i kahi hoʻokolohua e hōʻoia iaʻu he hewa, akā makemake wau... Pākuhi hou »
Aloha Eric, do manaʻo ʻoe ua hyperbolising paha mākou i kēia ʻano, ke ala aʻu e ʻike ai ʻo ka mua a me ka hope he mau loa ia, ʻo ke Akua mau loa, ʻaʻohe mea ma mua o ka "mua" a ʻaʻohe mea ma hope o ka hope. Mai poina iā Iesū ka inoa like. Rev 1:17
ʻAe au i ka Makua a me ke Keiki mau loa. ʻAʻole pono mākou e maopopo pehea e holo ai, akā no nā nerd i waena o mākou (hewa), leʻaleʻa mau ka hoʻāʻo ʻana.
Kuhi paha ʻoe i kahi mea nui; ka manawa a me ka manawa o ka honua mea. ʻO mākou, no kēlā aupuni iā mākou iho, ua nakinaki ʻia e kēlā ao, i ka hiki i mākou ke hoʻololi i ka loli a me ka hiki iā mākou ke hoʻomaopopo. ʻO nā hanana ma mua o ka manawa a ke Akua i hana ai i ka Universe material hiki ʻole ke ana ʻia e nā kūlana o ka Universe material. he mea kūpono ke loaʻa nā hanana ma mua o ia manawa, akā aia kēia ma waho o ko mākou aupuni a ma ʻō aku o nā mea i hiki iā mākou ke hoʻomaopopo. ʻO nā ʻepekema e aʻo nei i ka cosmology e koi ana e hiki ke huli i nā hanana i kahi kiko a lākou... Pākuhi hou »
ʻO ka mea aʻu i kau mua ai he mea ʻole naʻu akā ua kope ʻia. ʻOi aku ka lōʻihi o ka mea ma mua o kaʻu i kope a kau ai ma aneʻi. Me he mea lā e hoʻāʻo wau e hoʻokomo iā ia i kahi palapala a leka uila iā ʻoe.
ʻO koʻu manaʻo e kau i nā mea e ʻike ai inā e kamaʻilio like ʻia ka mea i loko o ia mea i ka holo ʻana o ka moʻo. Manaʻo wau e hāpai ʻia nā nīnau e hāpai ʻia a i ka papa o kēia pūʻulu i ka mea.
ʻO ka manawa a me kahi e pili ana i ka Realm Material. ʻIke mākou i ka manawa ma waena o nā hanana ʻelua. Hiki iā ia nā hanana i ka hōʻino ʻana o ka cesium atom, ʻo ia ke kumu no nā uaki nui nui, a i ʻole ka helu ʻana o ke awakea kiʻekiʻe ma kahi kikoʻī, e like me ka hoʻohana ʻia i loko o ka mōʻaukala kanaka. ʻO ke ana paha e kūʻē ana i ka hae kino. ʻO nā mea āpau, a ʻo nā wahi hakahaka hoʻi ma waena o nā mea, he ana o ke ao kino. Ma waho o ke ao kino, loaʻa mākou i ka ʻike zero. ʻAʻohe ala e hele i waho o nā palena o ko mākou ʻike, no ka mea, ʻo kēia... Pākuhi hou »
(Kinohi 1: 1). . I kinohi hana ke Akua i ka lani a me ka honua. (Kinohi 1: 5). . A ʻo ke ahiahi a hiki mai kakahiaka, he lā mua. . . (Kinohi 1:14). . ʻAndlelo maila ke Akua: "I mau mālamalama i loko o ke aouli o ka lani e hoʻokaʻawale i waena o ke ao a me ka pō; a pono lākou e lawelawe ma ke ʻano he hōʻailona a no nā kau a no nā lā a me nā makahiki ʻaʻole ka manawa ponoʻī kahi mea e kū ma kāna iho. He ana ia ma waena o kekahi hanana a me kekahi hanana kino. Ma ʻaneʻi wale nō... Pākuhi hou »
Maikaʻi maikaʻi.
ʻO Merci Jack
Raisonnement maʻalahi, logique a me surtout biblique.
Ne nous perdons pas dans des spéculations sur Dieu que nous ne maîtrisons pas. ʻO ka ʻepekema ʻoihana no ka mua ʻole. Elle a parfois changé de concensions suite a de nouvelles découvertes.
ʻAʻole, ʻaʻohe palapala hemolele, akā ʻo ka manawa a me ka manawa kahi o ka honua material, a ʻo ke Akua kahi o ka ʻuhane. ʻOiai ʻo ia ka mea nāna i hana a me kahi kumu o ka honua mea, ʻo ia, ma ka wehewehe ʻana, ʻaʻole ʻāpana o ka ao material.
Pololei, Chet.
A kūʻokoʻa ke Akua i ka manawa no ka mea ua hana ʻo ia i ka manawa ma ke ʻāpana o ka Universe:
"Na ia i hana nā mea āpau; a i ʻole ia e hana i kekahi mea i hana ʻia. (Ioane 1: 3). Nā mea āpau - a me nā mea waiwai āpau, me ka manawa.
Pili ka manawa, mea, hakahaka a me ka ikehu i ka pilina (Einstein's Theory of Relativity). Hōʻoiaʻiʻo loa kēia kuhi (e like me kā Eric i ʻōlelo ai). Inā ʻaʻole hiki i kēia kumumanaʻo ke hiki ʻole ke hoʻōla i kahi ʻimi ākea e like me Voyager a i ʻole nā mea ʻē aʻe e hele pololei i nā hēkū. ʻO ia ke kumu i manaʻo ai ua loaʻa iā mākou ka paukū - John 1: 3.
Ke nīnau wale,
Manaʻoʻiʻo ʻoe ke noho nei ke Akua i kahi ākea e like me mākou e noho ai i kahi? Kahi ākea? A i ʻole kahi ʻuhane?
Inā kahi ʻuhane e ʻae wau. Inā pēlā, pehea ʻoe e wehewehe ai i kēia ʻuhane? Ua kaupalena ʻia? He palena palena ʻole e hoʻopiha ana i nā mea āpau?
He wehewehe paha ia? Ka lani anei?
E pili ana i kekahi mau manaʻo ma ka KJV ma lalo - makemake wau i kekahi manawa i ka heluhelu ʻana i ka KJV, a manaʻoʻiʻo ua kākau nani ʻia ia ma kekahi mau ʻano. Akā he nui nā mea e noʻonoʻo ai i ka wā e aʻo ai me kahi aniani exegetical. ʻO ka mea mua, inā ke aʻo ʻana i kahi mana kahiko, archaic ka KJV, ʻaʻole maʻalahi e hoʻomaopopo. ʻOiaʻiʻo, ua hoʻomaikaʻi maikaʻi nā mana hou o kēia au i ka hiki ke hoʻomaopopo i ka ʻōlelo. Akā inā e heluhelu ana i kahi mana kahiko, nā huaʻōlelo e like me (me ka ʻole o nā ʻōlelo puanaʻī): palmerworm, quarternion, emerods, chalkstones, assupim kekahi o nā kaukani o ka archaic hanana o... Pākuhi hou »
ʻO IEHOVA O KOA? Hoʻokahi Kanaka Hoʻokahi a i ʻole ʻāpana o ka Trio Euanelio?
ʻ sayslelo ʻo ka hui o ka Haku o ka pūʻali: Ma Hell wale nō, e ʻike ai mākou. Luka 16:17
ʻO Hades, kekahi akua Helene mai ke ala hoʻi, ʻaʻole hiki ke hoʻomālamalama i kahi pāʻani ma Hell.
Wahi a ka haumana a Iesu Kristo i aloha ai. Luka 16: 23-26 HUA
“E noʻonoʻo pono i kāu mea e heluhelu ai
ʻae ʻia ke Kānāwai me hoʻokahi Palapala Kālā. ”
Nā hoʻomaikaʻi i nā mea āpau i kēia mau manawa o ka nūhou hoʻopunipuni a me ka ʻoiaʻiʻo huna. E ʻoluʻolu e hoʻolohe no ka Shepard ʻoiaʻiʻo Iesu Kristo.
Psalmbee
Ua hoʻomaha wau i kaʻu hihia mai kaʻu mau manaʻo 3 mau lā aku nei
"ʻAʻole loa he kumuhana i hoʻopilikia i ka lōkahi o nā Kristiano e like me ke Kahikolu.
Ua hala nā mea he nui i nā hola makehewa i ka hoʻāʻo ʻana e hōʻoia i nā poʻe ʻē aʻe he pololei kekahi ʻaoʻao a ʻo kekahi ʻaoʻao paha mai ke kenekulia ʻekolu. "
Ua manaʻoʻiʻo paha kekahi i kēia manawa e hoʻololi i ko lākou manaʻoʻiʻo i ke Trinity? e ʻoluʻolu e hāpai i kou lima!
ʻO Eric ʻatikala maikaʻi loa, ʻaʻole hiki ke kali no ka hoʻoiho ʻelua, hoʻomākaukau i kaʻu popcorn!
☺️✌️ ♥ ️
Buttered, lana koʻu manaʻo. Yum.
Lol Eric Manaʻo wau ʻaʻole makemake kekahi i ka popcorn buttered he minus kāu
Inā ʻoe e nalo i kaʻu ʻōlelo iā Leonardo Eric, hiki iā ʻoe ke wehewehe i kou manaʻo ma ke kuhikuhi ʻana iā Iesū ʻo ke Akua? E waiho iā ia no ka mea hope inā makemake ʻoe e hana pēlā i kahi hōʻike ma hope. ʻO ia wale nō ka loaʻa ʻana o kahi ʻokoʻa ʻokoʻa no ka poʻe me nā ʻano ʻokoʻa a me ka hōʻike ʻana i nā mea like ʻole o ka hoʻopaʻa haʻawina.
Aloha i nā poʻe a pau mai Alithia.
ʻO nā puanaʻī hoihoi mai Apolo. No kahi naʻaupō e like me aʻu, hiki iā mākou ke wehewehe inā ʻae ʻia ka ʻōlelo i hoʻohana ʻia i nā ʻōlelo ʻē aʻe i kahi "Akua" ma mua o ke "Akua" wale nō? He Akua mana loa anei ke Akua? Me he mea lā he kumu kēia o ka huikau. ʻO Iesū ponoʻī ka mea i ʻōlelo i ka mele 82; 6 "he akua nō ʻoukou āpau". Inā wau e kuhikuhi i ke Akua, ʻike ʻoe a ʻike wau i ka manaʻo o ka mea hana, a i ʻole iā Iēhova. Hiki paha i kēia hoʻopaʻapaʻa ke kuhi hewa i nā mea i kākau ʻia i loko o ka Baibala a me ka manaʻo o kēlā mau Karistiano mua.... Pākuhi hou »
ʻO wau ka lua o kāu ʻōlelo Leo hiki iā Eric ke wehewehe i kāna manaʻo ke pili ʻo ia iā Iesū ke Akua ???
Ua ʻike mākou ua kipa aku nā ʻānela iā ʻAberahama no ka mea ʻo ka Hebera, i loko o kāna mau mokuna hoʻomaka, e wehewehe ana ʻo ia ka hihia. Eia naʻe i ka heluhelu ʻana i ka moʻohelu, ʻo kekahi o nā ʻānela (a i ʻole kekahi o nā kāne) i kapa ʻia ʻo Iēhova, me he mea lā e kū ana ʻo Iēhova i mua o ʻAberahama. Akā ʻaʻohe kanaka i ʻike i ke Akua. No laila ʻike wau he ʻānela ia e hana ana ma ke ʻano he waha ʻōlelo na ke Akua. I kā mākou moʻomeheu ʻaʻole paha mākou e hana i kahi kuhi a i ʻole kuhihewa, akā i kahi Hebera i kēlā manawa i ʻae maikaʻi ʻia. Inā wau e kamaʻilio me ʻoe ma ke kelepona a haʻi... Pākuhi hou »
Inā he aha kāu e manaʻo ai he 'lunamakaʻāinana a ke Akua' a kū i kahi o ke Akua a laila e ʻae wau me ʻoe a me kēia. Hoʻomaopopo maikaʻi ʻia kēia manaʻo moho i ka pilina Hebraic i kākau ʻia a waha hoʻi. Aia kahi hiʻohiʻona kahi e hōʻike ʻia iā mākou he alakaʻi koa e noi ana iā Iesu e hele mai e hōʻola i kāna kauā a me kahi moʻohelu like kahi o nā lunakahiko Iudaio i hele mai e noi iā Iesu e hele i kāna kauā maʻi a hoʻōla iā ia. ʻAʻohe mea paio ma aneʻi i ka wā i hele aku ai nā lunakahiko iā Iesū ma ke ʻano he 'lunamakaʻāinana' o ka... Pākuhi hou »
ʻO Eric, ua hānai ʻia wau ma ke ʻano he katolika Roma, a hōʻike mau ʻia ke kolu me he mea pohihihi lā. ʻAʻohe kumu. ʻOiai ʻaʻole he Akua ʻoi aku ʻo Iesū ma mua o nā ʻānela ʻo Iēhova, e like me kāu i ʻōlelo ai, ʻaʻohe oʻu pilikia me nā paukū i ka NT e hoʻohana nei i ka inoa, ke Akua. Me he mea lā iaʻu inā ʻike ka poʻe kākau iā Iesū ke keiki a ke Akua, a laila ke hōʻike nei lākou i ka mahalo ma ke kuhikuhi ʻana i nā mea i hana ʻia e ia mai ke Akua mai. Maʻalahi loa e like me kaʻu e kau ai. Akā ʻaʻole ia e kāohi iā Iesu i kāhea ʻia a... Pākuhi hou »
He mea nui kēlā. "ʻOiai ʻaʻole he Akua ʻoi aku ʻo Iesū ma mua o nā ʻānela ʻo Iēhova, e like me kāu i ʻōlelo ai, ʻaʻohe oʻu pilikia me nā paukū ma ka NT e hoʻohana nei i ka inoa, ke Akua. Me he mea lā iaʻu inā ʻike ka poʻe kākau iā Iesū ke keiki a ke Akua, a laila ke hōʻike nei lākou i ka mahalo ma ke kuhikuhi ʻana i nā mea i hana ʻia e ia mai ke Akua mai. " ʻO ka mea maoli nā mea āpau i loaʻa ma muli o ke Akua Mana Loa. Inā inu wau i ka wai, ʻo kēlā mea maʻalahi ka makana a ke Akua, inā mākou e hoʻi i nā kumu hope loa. Na... Pākuhi hou »
ʻO Leonardo ka mea nui, a mahalo iā ʻoe no kēlā mau laʻana maikaʻi loa. E lawelawe maikaʻi lākou iaʻu i ka pane ʻana i ka pahu o nā ʻōlelo Pro-Trinity e kiʻi nei ma ka pūnaewele YouTube.
ʻAe, a ʻo ia ke kiko a Penton i hana ai i loko o ke wikiō. John 1: 1 hiki ke heluhelu grammatically e like me "ke akua ka huaʻōlelo" a i ʻole "he akua ka huaʻōlelo". ʻO kēlā me kēia kanaka kūpono me ka ʻike o ka grammar Greek e ʻae i ka maopopo ʻole o ka maopopo ʻole, a no laila ʻaʻole hiki ke hoʻohana ʻia ka paukū e hōʻoia ai i ka ʻike, Arian a i ʻole Trinitary.
Ua ʻōlelo ʻo Kristo ma ʻIsaia 44: 6 i nā manawa he nui i Hōʻike ... "ʻO wau ka mua a me ka hope ..." ... a i loko o kēlā palapala hemolele i loko o ʻIsaia, e ʻōlelo ana ʻo Iēhova ...
ʻO Iesū ka mua a me ka mea hope loa a ʻo Iesū ka mua a me ka hope. ʻAno kūpono, akā ʻo ka mua a me ka hope he aha?
ʻO ia ka mea nui o ka hoʻopuka. ʻAʻole lawa kā mākou ʻike e hele ma mua o ka mea i kākau ʻia. I kekahi mau kūkā kamaʻilio ʻana, ua ʻike ʻia wau e kāhea aku iā "37", kahi e hāpai pono ai i nā maka hakahaka. A laila wehewehe wau, ʻo 37 ka helu maopopo o nā ʻānela i hiki ke hulahula ma ke poʻo o ka pine. ʻO 37 ia, a ʻike wau he ʻoiaʻiʻo maoli nō. ʻO kaʻu kumu e hiki ai i nā kūkākūkā ke lilo i minutiae ʻole. Aia kekahi "ʻae," akā hiki ke hoʻohui ʻia a me kahi lua lāpaki hiki ke ʻike ʻia i kahi hohonu loa, akā he aha ka hopena o kēia? I ka 'oiaʻiʻo,... Pākuhi hou »
Noʻu, ʻo ka pilikia me ke aʻo ʻana o ke Trinity ka mea e hoʻololi i ko mākou ʻike i ka makuakāne. ʻO nā mea āpau e pili ana i ka hoʻihoʻi ʻana i ka pilina ʻohana i nalowale i ka wā i hana hewa ai ʻo Adamu. Makemake ka diabolō e hāʻule kēia. ʻO kēlā me kēia mea e kānalua i kā mākou pilina me ka makuakāne he hiki ke hoʻoweliweli i ko mākou ola. No nā miliona o nā Karistiano e koi nei i ke Trinity ʻo kā lākou ʻike aʻo - a mai hana i iwi e pili ana ia, manaʻo lākou ʻo kēia ke ʻano aʻo hoʻokahi e hōʻike ana i nā Karistiano maoli - manaʻo lākou ʻo Iesu ke Akua. Akā haʻi mai ʻo Iesū iā mākou i ke ala i ka... Pākuhi hou »
Maikaʻi maikaʻi.
Hoʻokomo ʻia ka ʻōlelo o ka Trinity i ka jargon i kūlike ʻole me ka ʻike honua maoli. Hoʻopiʻi ka hapa nui iaʻu ma ke ʻano he kamaʻilio pālua.
Ooo… aloha wau i kahi hoʻopaʻapaʻa ...! ʻO kaʻu e haʻo nui nei ...! A ʻaʻole anei he mea kupanaha ke kūʻokoʻa i ka hoʻopaʻapaʻa, e oʻu mau hoahānau ...?! No laila ... eia kaʻu e lawe ai i ka shebang holoʻokoʻa ... (ʻoiaʻiʻo ka ʻoiaʻiʻo a pau ... ʻaʻole no ka kāne e hoʻoholo ai i ka methinks ... no ka mea ʻo kaʻu mau ʻike ponoʻī ia a me ka launa pū ʻana me ka Haku e hoʻokahua i koʻu manaʻoʻiʻo ... akā ʻo kēia mau mea pilikino ... a i kekahi manawa, ineffable ...) Hoʻomaka wau e heluhelu i ka Revelation i kekahi manawa ma hope ... akā ua huikau wau, ua kū wau ... (malia paha ua hakakā wau e waiho i kaʻu eisegesis ...) akā ua ʻike... Pākuhi hou »
Eia naʻe, ʻaʻole hoʻohana ka palapala hemolele i hoʻoulu ʻia i nā hua ʻōlelo omnipotent, omnipresent a omniscient paha. ʻO kēia nā mea āpau a ka poʻe e ʻōlelo ai e pili ana i ke Akua, ka mea nāna i hana, ʻaʻole nā mea a ke Akua ka mea nāna i hana i ʻike ai e kūpono e ʻōlelo e pili ana iā ia iho. Ua ʻōlelo maikaʻi ʻo Paul ma 1 Korinto 4: 6 "Ua noi wau i kēia mau mea iaʻu a me ʻApolo no ko ʻoukou pono, e nā hoahānau, i aʻo ʻia ai e mākou e mākou, ʻaʻole e hele i mua o ka mea i palapala ʻia, i ʻole e haʻakei kekahi o ʻoukou. "I nā makahiki i hala aku nei, ua noʻonoʻo wau e lawe i kahi transplant pūnaewele, ma ke ʻano he ʻāpana olakino.... Pākuhi hou »
ʻLelo ʻo Chet,
"Akā hoʻi, ʻaʻole i hoʻohana ka palapala hemolele i hoʻohihi ʻia i nā huaʻōlelo mana, mana āpau a ʻike ʻole paha. ʻO kēia nā mea āpau a ka poʻe e ʻōlelo ai e pili ana i ke Akua, ka mea nāna i hana, ʻaʻole nā mea a ke Akua ka mea nāna i hana i ʻike ai e kūpono e ʻōlelo e pili ana iā ia iho. "
Aloha Chet,
I ka mana mana o ka Baibala ma Rev 19: 6 KJV hoʻohana maoli ia i ka huaʻōlelo "omnipotent".
A ʻo ka hapa nui o nā unuhi ʻē aʻe ʻaʻole. He aha nā hōʻike e ʻike ai ka mana o ka Mōʻī James ma nā ala i kū ʻole ai nā unuhi ʻē aʻe? ʻAʻole hoʻohana ka preponderance ʻoi loa o nā unuhi Pelekane i kēlā huaʻōlelo a hoʻohana i ka Mea Mana Loa.
ʻO nā hōʻike i hāʻawi ʻia iaʻu ma loko o ka Palapala Hemolele iho. ʻLelo ʻoe: ” ʻAʻole hoʻohana ka preponderance ʻoi loa o nā unuhi Pelekane i kēlā huaʻōlelo a hoʻohana i ka Mana Loa. ”
Heʻoiaʻiʻo kēlā o nā mana āpau ʻole. No kēlā mea pono kēlā me kēia e wehewehe i ka Baibala i kā lākou ʻōlelo ponoʻī. ʻLelo ʻoe ʻaʻole ʻoe e hāʻule i ka paʻa o nā kāne e like me ia. Akā ʻaʻole anei ia ka mea āu e hana nei ke hoʻohana ʻoe i nā unuhi he nui mai nā kāne a haʻalele i ka Mea Hoʻokele.
ʻAʻole anei ʻo ia ke kumu ʻo Sātana ʻo ia? No ka mahalo ʻole i ka Mana.
Hakumbee, Roma 13: 1
----------------, he aha kou kumu no ka hoʻopiʻi ʻana i ka JVV ʻo “ka mea mana”, ʻoiai ʻaʻole kekahi.
Aloha Meleti, ʻo kaʻu kumu wale nō no ka ʻUhane Hemolele o Kristo, kāna Wai hoʻōla a me kāna Koko i hoʻokahe ʻia no ka uku pānaʻi ma ke Keʻa. (1Jn 5: 8 NWT) E haʻi iaʻu, manaʻo ʻoe ua hānau ʻia wau ma lalo o kahi hōʻailona maikaʻi ʻole me ka mahina polū i koʻu mau maka, a he Green Bible paha i piha i ka bias? ʻO ka hoʻāʻo a ʻoiaʻiʻo koʻu ʻike me ka KJV. Ua ʻae ʻia e ka lei aliʻi o ʻEnelani a ʻaʻole naʻe e wehe ʻia. (participle i hala) Ma mua o kekahi mau ʻona inu ʻona ʻona me ka waina a ka wahine hoʻokamakama, ʻaʻole au i ʻike i kekahi a i ʻole kekahi Aliʻi e hoʻāʻo nei e lawe i ka... Pākuhi hou »
No laila ʻo King James o ʻEnelani ʻae ʻana e hoʻokani i nā mea ʻē aʻe āpau? Kuhi paha ʻoe e ʻike i ka hana a ka ʻuhane hemolele a i ʻole ʻo ka ʻuhane o Kristo ia e hiki ai iā ʻoe ke ʻōlelo i nā unuhi baibala i ʻae ʻia a ʻo wai ʻole?
Welina ʻoe i kou manaʻo, ʻoiaʻiʻo.
E waiho wale wau ia mea no kēia manawa.
Meleti, (Pr 14:12 NWT)
Hilinaʻi wau i ka Baibala, no ka mea ua wānana ʻia nā wānana. Manaʻoʻiʻo wau ia no ka mea ʻo nā mea i kākau ʻia i loko o ka Baibala, mau tausani mau makahiki i hala aku nei i paʻa i nā makahiki i hala. Inā na ke Akua ka Baibala i hoʻokumu ʻia, aʻu i manaʻoʻiʻo ai, he mea pono e mālama ʻo ia i kāna ʻōlelo. ʻOiai ʻaelike ʻole nā unuhi like ʻole i kēlā me kēia paukū, nā hana hōʻuluʻulu e kōkua i ka mālama ʻana i ka manaʻo kumu. Me nā pono hana e like me Bible Hub, ua maʻalahi ka noiʻi a me ka hoʻohālikelike ʻana i nā unuhi. Maliʻa paha he hoʻolako kēia mai kā mākou Mea Hana. Hoʻokahi mea maopopo leʻa, i kaʻu... Pākuhi hou »
Ua ʻae ʻia e wai? Inā ʻaʻole ʻae ʻia e YEHOVA a me Iesū paha, e hōʻemi ana i ka manaʻo o kekahi kanaka a i ʻole nā hui o kekahi kanaka. I kēlā hihia, ʻaʻole wau e kahaha.
ʻO ke kumuhana hoihoi, akā IMO hāʻule ka mea i ka kūkulu ʻana i nā kāne mauu like i hoʻohana ʻia e JW e hoʻāʻo a ʻōlelo i ka ʻike binitary i ulu i mau kenekulia ma hope o Kristo a me nā lunaʻōlelo. ʻO ka hapa nui he wahaheʻe ʻole ia. Ma mua o ka hōʻike ikaika i hāʻawi ʻia e John a me nā mea kākau Baibala ʻē aʻe, nui nā hōʻike kākau moʻolelo mōʻaukala no ka Christology kiʻekiʻe o ka halepule mua. Me ka hōʻaiʻe iā https://www.patheos.com/blogs/geneveith/2018/03/extremely-early-testimonies-to-the-deity-of-christ/ eia kekahi mau hiʻohiʻona nui: Polycarp (AD 69-155) ʻo ia nō ka pīhopa ma ka hale pule ma Semurena a he haumana a Ioane ʻAhope. I kāna Palapala i ko Pilipi, kākau ʻo ia, I kēia manawa... Pākuhi hou »
Ua kākau ʻoe:
"Kumuhana hoihoi, akā IMO hāʻule ka mea i loko o ke kūkulu ʻana i nā kāne mauʻu i hoʻohana ʻia e JWs e hoʻāʻo a ʻōlelo i ka ʻike binitary i ulu i mau kenekulia ma hope o Kristo a me nā lunaʻōlelo."
ʻAʻole maopopo iaʻu ke ʻano o ka hoʻopaʻapaʻa Strawman. Hiki iā ʻoe ke kikoʻī hou aʻe?
ʻAʻole i kū koke ka Council Nicene. ʻAʻole ia i ola i kahi hawewe. Aia paha he undercurrent o ke kuhi hewa ʻana a me nā hilinaʻi kuhihewa, kaomi politika a me nā kumu ʻē aʻe e hoʻākoakoa ai kēia ʻaha. ʻO kahi mea koʻikoʻi nui i hāʻule ʻole ka mahalo o ka hapa nui, ʻo ka kāohi a me ka hoʻoponopono ʻana o ka Palapala Hemolele i hakakā ʻia mai nā Iudaio manaʻoʻiʻo Kalikiano i loaʻa ka manaʻo kūpono, a ma hope iho ua lawelawe ʻia e nā Helene i aʻo ʻia i ka akeakamai Helene. ʻO ia paha ke kumu o ka hapa nui ʻoiai lākou e noho kokoke ana i ka manawa o ka... Pākuhi hou »
Pololei! Ua ʻike maka wau i ka mea e hiki i nā manaʻo kanaka ke hana e hōʻino ai i nā aʻo ʻana i ka Baibala. Ma muli wale nō o ka hoʻokō ʻana o kekahi i kahi poʻo inoa i hana ʻia e ke kanaka, ʻaʻole ia iaʻu he mana ʻoi aku ko kēia kanaka ma mua o ka hoa aʻe. Me he mea lā iaʻu ke emi nui nei ka JW Organization, i kaʻu kākau ʻana i kēia. Aloha nui wau i kēlā me kēia mea i loko e ʻike paha i nā ʻano huikau, akā ʻaʻole wau e kala no ka poʻe i nā kūlana alakaʻi a lākou i noho ai i ka hilinaʻi a me ka manawaleʻa o ka poʻe kūpaʻa. Akā ʻaʻole paʻakikī kēia kūlana; nui nā hale pule nui e like me... Pākuhi hou »
Ke nānā nei i mua i nā ʻāpana e hiki mai ana o kēia kamaʻilio. He mea hou ka manawa henotheistic iaʻu, a manaʻo wau ua lohe wau i nā mea āpau ke pili i ke kūkākūkā e pili ana i ke Kahikolu. Mahalo wau i kā Alithia ʻōlelo e pili ana i “kahi ʻōlelo akāka i loko o ka Baibala hoʻokahi mea, ʻoiai ʻo ka wehewehe kanaka ka mea ʻē aʻe. Ae au. ʻAe, ʻae pū wau me nā poʻe ʻē aʻe i ʻōlelo ʻo kekahi hoʻopiʻi i ka palapala hemolele he hoʻopiʻi ia i ka wehewehe o ka palapala hemolele. A hiki i kēia, ʻoiaʻiʻo ʻole me ka manaʻo ʻole, e hoʻolilo iā ʻoe iho i kahi mana kiʻekiʻe aʻe ma mua o ka palapala hemolele iho. (Inā wau e waiho wale i koʻu ʻae ʻana, ka mea aʻu e waiho ai... Pākuhi hou »
I ka wā a ke Akua i hoʻāla mai ai i nā kāula, ua hōʻike ʻia kāna kākoʻo o lākou e ko lākou wānana e kō ana. Akā i nā hihia he nui, kahi o ka manawa ke kumu, hāʻawi ʻo ia i nā hōʻailona e hōʻike ana i ke kākoʻo kūlohelohe nei kēia mau kāula. No laila, i ka manawa i hāʻawi ʻia ai iā Mose ka hana no ka hoʻokuʻu ʻana i nā mamo a ʻIseraʻela mai ʻAigupita mai, ua ʻike ka poʻe ʻIseraʻela i nā ʻino he ʻumi, a ua ʻike lākou hiki iā lākou ke hilinaʻi iā Mose. I ka wā i kui ʻia ai lākou me ka pūʻali koa ʻAigupita e pani ana, ua hana ʻo ia i kahi hana mana mana loa e kōkua ai i ko lākou pakele. ʻAʻole ʻo ia kekahi clown i hōʻike ʻia me kahi patter hoihoi a... Pākuhi hou »
ʻAe like wau me Chet ma kēia. Pono mākou e hoʻomanaʻo ua hoʻohana ʻia ka huaʻōlelo ekalesia e unuhi i ka huaʻōlelo Helene ʻo ekklésia ʻo ia hoʻi "ke anaina, ʻākoakoa" a pili maoli i ka poʻe i "kāhea ʻia". ʻAʻole ia i manaʻo ʻia e kuhikuhi i kahi kino i hoʻonohonoho ʻia e like me ka hale pule Kakōlika, ka hale pule Molemona, a me ka hale pule ʻo ʻEnelani. ʻO ke kino o Kristo e pili ana i ka poʻe i hea ʻia (ekklésia) mai ka honua e lilo i keiki na ke Akua. Eia nō naʻe, i kēia mau lā ke ʻōlelo ʻoe "halepule" ʻoe e pili pili ana i nā alakaʻi a i nā ʻekalesia ʻekalesia paha e hoʻomalu nei i kēlā ʻano hoʻomana. Āhea... Pākuhi hou »
Meleti lāua ʻo Chet, mahalo wau i kāu mau manaʻo ʻelua a ʻae pū me nā mea he nui āu e ʻōlelo ai. ʻAe ʻae au me ka naʻau āpau e hana ana ka ʻUhane Hemolele ma waho o ka hale pule Katolika. A manaʻoʻiʻo wau he nui nā mea a ka poʻe Kalikiano Kakolika e aʻo aku ai i ka Katolika awelika e pili ana i ke aʻo ʻana i nā palapala hemolele a me ke kūkulu ʻana i ka pilina me ke Akua. ʻAe ʻae wau i ka hana ʻino a ka hale pule i kona mana (on and off) i lalo i nā kenekulia. He laʻana kaulana ʻo Joan of Arc, a i kēia lā hoʻohanohano ʻia ʻo ia ma ke ʻano he laʻa. No laila ke kamaʻilio nei e pili ana i ka mana, ʻike wau i kahi ʻokoʻa nui ma waena o ka ʻUhane Hemolele... Pākuhi hou »
'Leloʻo Iesū e pili ana i kona Makua a me ko mākou Makua mai ka Lani mai i loko o ka Baibala. ʻ saylelo ʻo ia "inā ua ʻike ʻoe iaʻu ua ʻike ʻoe i ka Makua", "inā ʻike ʻoe iaʻu pehea e hiki ai iā ʻoe ke ʻōlelo ʻaʻole ʻoe i ʻike i ka Makua"? Haʻi pololei ka Baibala iā mākou ʻo wai ko Iesu Makua Lani. Matt 1:18 e hoʻohālikelike i nā memo a ke Kauka ma Luka 1:35. ʻO ka ʻānela o ka Haku a me ka ʻānela a ka Haku ma Mat 1:20 i unuhi ʻole ʻia, ʻaʻohe mea like Pelekane like. No laila inā makemake ʻoe e hoʻohana iā Y a i ʻole J a i ʻole H a i ʻole W paha iā V ia... Pākuhi hou »
I ka wā e pili ana i ka Trinity, pono e mālama ʻia kekahi mau pilikia. ʻO John 1: 1, i koʻu manaʻo, he hapa liʻiliʻi ia. ʻO ka nīnau nui: E hoʻomana ʻia ʻo Iesū? Matt 4:10 (ESV): "A laila ʻī akula ʻo Iesū iā ia, E hele ʻoe, e Sātana; No ka mea, ua palapala ʻia, "E hoʻomana ʻoe i ka Haku i kou Akua, ʻo ia wale nō kāu e mālama aku ai." "No laila, iā ʻoe nō iā Iesū e ʻōlelo nei e mālama wale i ke Akua. ʻ saylelo nā Unitarians: "Ma laila ʻoe e hele ai. ʻAʻole hiki iā ʻoe ke hoʻomana a mālama iā Iesū. ” Akā, ua ʻae anei ka palapala hemolele? Pehea ʻo Daniel 7: 13,14? “ʻIke akula au ma nā hihiʻo i ka pō, aia hoʻi, me nā ao o ka lani ma laila... Pākuhi hou »
ʻO ka ʻōlelo makua e hoʻōla. No laila ua kapa ʻia ʻo Iesū he makua kāne like ʻole a like me 1 Kol. 15:45 ʻōlelo:
Pēlā ia i palapala ʻia ai, "ʻO ke kanaka mua ʻo ʻAdamu, ua lilo ia i mea ola"; ua lilo ʻo Adamu hope i uhane ola. HE KAKAKAAKA KAKAUA.
ʻO Iesu kā mākou King-mediator a Highpriest paha. ʻO nā mea kiʻekiʻe loa ma waena o nā hui ʻelua, ke kanaka e pule nei a me ke Akua e pule nei iā ia ma o Iesū.
aloha
Maria ?
ʻO kahi manaʻo iā Iesu kahi mea ola e ʻike ai ka hāʻawi ʻana o ka Ransom i nā kānaka i ka mea a Adamu i hoʻokau ʻole ai i kona ʻoihana. ʻO Adamu ka makua ʻiʻo o nā kānaka a pau, akā i hala i ke ola ʻaʻole me ka hopena o ka make. Hele ʻo Iesū i kahi manawa kūpono e hoʻopiʻi ai i ka mea a Adamu i hoʻopā aku. I loko o kēlā ʻano, hiki iā ia ke ʻōlelo ʻo ia i ke Keiki Kūlike. ʻOiai ke pau ka hoʻihoʻi ʻana, e lilo ʻo Iesū i mea ola a pau i ke kanaka.
@Chete
Ua maopopo oe i ka mea aʻu e hoao nei e olelo. ʻO Iesū ko mākou makua kāne mau, akā ʻaʻole ʻo ia ʻo mākou ABBA. Ke manaʻoʻiʻo nei au i ko mākou Akua a ʻo Iesū ke Keiki a ke Akua.
I mai la o Iesu, aole e hiki ia ia ke hana i kahi mea me ka nana ole ia mai ka Makua mai.
Ma mua o kona make ʻana, pule ʻo ia me ka waimaka i kona Makua a ʻoluʻolu ʻia e kahi ʻānela.
Ua ʻōlelo ʻo Iosua i ka ʻIseraʻela, E hoʻolohe ʻoukou i hoʻokahi Akua.
Manaʻo nā Pagans i nā trinities, e like me nā hindugods.
Maria ?
Aloha Chet. Manaʻo maikaʻi. E haʻi wau i kahiʻano koʻikoʻi o Iesū. ʻO Iesū (Word) he makuakāne mau loa. Ma ke Keiki a ke Akua, ua loaʻa iā ia kahi ʻano kū hoʻokahi o kona Makua - He ola i loko ona iho! A no laila he mea mau loa ia, a no laila hiki iā ia ke hoʻōla: "He ʻoiaʻiʻo kaʻu e ʻōlelo aku nei iā ʻoukou, e hiki mai ana ka manawa, a ʻo nei hoʻi ia, e lohe ai ka poʻe make i ka leo o ke Keiki a ke Akua, a me ka poʻe e lohe e ola ana. No ka mea, e like me ka Makua he ola kona i loko ona iho, pēlā hoʻi ia i hāʻawi mai ai i ke Keiki i ola iā ia... Pākuhi hou »
Mahalo wau i kou mau manaʻo ma kēia kumuhana. Eia naʻe, e haʻalele mākou i ke koho balota.
Mahalo, e waiho ana_quietly. Nānā wau i kēlā mau paukū ʻekolu e haʻi pū nei iā Iesū. (Gal 1: 1; Efe 6:23; Pil 2:11) Ua hiki mai kahi manaʻo hoihoi iaʻu ma ke ʻano he hopena. No ke aha i ʻōlelo ʻole ai ʻo Paul a me nā mea kākau Baibala ʻē aʻe "Ke Akua ke keiki" pū, a "ko mākou akua hoʻi, ʻo Iesu Kristo" ma kahi o ko mākou Haku ʻo Iesū Kristo? Ke manaʻo nei wau, he aha kahi ala maikaʻi loa e hōʻike ai i ka ʻoiaʻiʻo inā ʻike ʻia ʻo Iesū e lākou ke Akua e like me IEHOVA, no ke aha e haʻi wale ʻole ai iā mākou? ʻAʻole lākou i hūnā i ka ʻoiaʻiʻo, akā he mau mea lawe māmā.
ʻAe, Eric, ua noʻonoʻo wau i ka mea like. ʻO kēia paha kekahi i loko o koʻu noʻonoʻo, lohe mau ʻo ia i ka ʻāpana ʻo ke Akua ka Makua. Heluhelu maoli ka Helene i ke Akua Makua (Theos Patros) me ka ʻōlelo ʻole o ka ʻatikala. ʻAʻole au ʻike maopopo ʻatikala Helene maʻa, akā e noʻonoʻo nei iaʻu ʻo Theou ho Patros paha a i ʻole The Theou Patros, akā ʻaʻole i loaʻa i kahi i loaʻa i laila. Ua maʻalahi hiki ke unuhi ʻia “ka Makua, ke Akua” a i ʻole ke Akua Hoʻolālā. Malia, e like me kaʻu i olelo ai, aole au i ike i ka Helene ua lawa makou i na olelo he nui i aneane paha. o au kekahi... Pākuhi hou »
Manaʻo wau he wahi maikaʻi loa kēia. Aia kahi puke e ulana ana iā Iesū i lilo ai i Akua, nāna e uhi i ka mōʻaukala o nā ʻaha kūkā o nā ʻano pule i hala i hala a pili i kēia mea. ʻAʻohe mea ʻoki ʻia a maloʻo ma ia mea a he wā mahele i waena o ka Ekalesia Hikina a me Komohana no kēia mea. ʻO ke Kumuhana Trinity, i ka wā i hoʻāpono ʻia ai, he kumuhana politika. Hoʻokahi ʻia nā poʻe e kekahi pūʻali, a laila hoʻokipa ʻia e kekahi ʻaoʻao a ua kono ʻia e launa pū me lākou. He kālai'āina kēia ma ka pae o ka Ekalesia, a ʻo ke kālai'āina hoʻi i ke aupuni... Pākuhi hou »
Je voudrais préciser que je ne crois pas en la Trinité et je fais bien la distinction entre YHWH et son fils. Néanmoins je voudrais rappeler les paroles de Jean 20: 27-28 [27] Puis il dit à Thomas: Avance ici ton doigt, et regarde mes mains; avance aussi ta main, et mets-la dans mon côté; et ne sois pas incrédule, mais crois. [28] ʻO Thomas lui répondit: ʻO Mon Seigneur et mon Dieu! ”Thomas appelle Christ” mon Dieu ”Ce verset nʻest pas là pour appuyer la Trinité mais… on ne peut pas dire quʻaucun apôtre nʻa qualifié le Christ de Dieu. Si quelquʻun a un... Pākuhi hou »
Aloha Nicole. E hoʻāʻo wau e wehewehe i kēia hiʻohiʻona me Thomas lāua ʻo Iesū e like me kaʻu e manaʻo nei. Toma ———- ikaika loa ko skepticism manaʻo manaʻo o Tomona. I ka nui o kona hilinaʻi ʻole ʻana i kekahi o nā lunaʻōlelo, me ia i hele pū ai me Iesū no 3.5 mau makahiki. Akā ʻaʻole ʻo ia i manaʻoʻiʻo iā Iesū kekahi, ua manaʻo ʻo ia i kona ala hou ʻana ʻaʻole hiki (John 20:25). Ma hope o nā mea āpau, he kāne ʻo Iesū. A i kēia manawa ua make ʻo ia. Kū koke maila ʻo Iesū i mua ona me kona mau ʻeha. Ua lilo paha ia i mea haʻalulu iā Toma, ka mea i manaʻoʻiʻo ʻaʻole hiki. Ua ʻike ʻo ia ʻaʻole hiki iā Iesū... Pākuhi hou »
Je suis dʻaccord.
ʻO "Iehova a me Iesū" kahi manawa hui aʻu e lohe ai i ka hoʻolei ʻia e ka poʻe e noho ana ma ka pā, e ʻae lākou i ka quinella akā ʻaʻole ka trifecta. ʻO ka ikaika hana a ke Akua, ma ke ala a kekahi i ʻike ai inā ua kākau ʻia ka NWT e like me ka ʻĀpana Hana a Iesū ma nā wahi āpau o kā lākou puke? ʻAʻole wau i ʻike i kākau ʻia pēlā. Aia kekahi mau mea pili kānāwai e pili ana i ke kumu e makemake ʻole ai lākou e kālā i ka manawa no lākou iho inā ʻaʻole lākou i hana ma mua o kēia manawa. 1 a me 1 e hana i 1 = 3. No kahi kuanaʻike ʻē aʻe, e ʻōlelo mākou he ʻelua akua ko mākou... Pākuhi hou »
E hoʻomaka iaʻu e hoʻomaikaʻi iā Eric a me James no ka paʻi ʻana i kēia ʻike. He mea ia e pono ai ka wehewehe ʻana no kekahi manawa, a ke manaʻo nei wau he hana maikaʻi ʻelua o ʻolua i kahi mākaʻikaʻi ʻana i ka wehewehe ʻana. Makemake pū wau e hōʻike i koʻu mahalo e kū ana ʻoukou ʻelua i ka hoʻohālike o ka poʻe i hele i kekahi o nā ʻano maikaʻi loa i hiki i ko JW ke pena, a puka mai me kāu hoʻomana Kristiano i hana ʻole ʻia. A maopopo ia iaʻu ʻaʻole hiki ke hana hou i nā hana JW, ʻoi aku ka manawa ma mua o ka manawa i ka hana ʻana... Pākuhi hou »
Mahalo, Chet. Hauʻoli nui wau i ka heluhelu ʻana i kāu ʻōlelo.
ʻO ka heluhelu wale ʻana ma aneʻi, pono wau e ʻae ua ʻakaʻaka wau i nā manawa he nui e heluhelu ana i nā manaʻo a me ka ʻatikala. Eia kahi pūʻulu o JW a me ex-JW i hoʻopaʻa paʻa ʻia e kūʻē i ke Trinity, i kēia manawa he aha ka manaʻo āu e hopena ai i kēia kumuhana? Mai ka mea aʻu e ʻike ai, 99.9% o ʻoukou ʻo ex-JW e hoʻohana nei i ka NWT. ʻO ia kekahi hanana ʻakaʻaka e hoʻohālikelike wau i ka like o ka hoʻohana ʻana i kahi papa inoa ʻo Sears a me Roebuck (kahi ʻoihana ʻole a waiwai ʻole ke ʻole ʻoe e pau i ka pepa kaukau) e kūʻai ai ma Wal-Mart. Mākala,... Pākuhi hou »
ʻAʻole loa he kumuhana i hoʻopilikia i ka lōkahi o nā Kristiano e like me ke Kahikolu. Nui ka poʻe i hoʻolilo i nā hola makehewa he nui i ka hoʻāʻo ʻana e hōʻoia i nā poʻe ʻē aʻe he pololei kekahi ʻaoʻao a ʻo kekahi ʻaoʻao paha mai ke kenekulia ʻekolu. Ua lilo ia i mea "breaker deal" no ka hapanui, a manaʻoʻiʻo ʻia (ʻoiai inā ʻaʻole hiki iā lākou ke wehewehe mai ka palapala hemolele) e ka hapa nui o nā Karistiano i kēia lā. Pono e nīnau kekahi ʻo wai ka mea makemake e kū i kēlā kūlana, ʻo wai ka pōmaikaʻi iā ia a ʻoi loa paha ʻo Sātana? He noʻonoʻo maʻalahi wau, ʻaʻole wau e komo hou i kēia mau hoʻopaʻapaʻa, keu hoʻi i ka ʻoihana, e pili ana i ke Trinity. Akā ʻike wau i ke kumuhana... Pākuhi hou »
Eric ʻike wau i ka pilina a Jim i hana ai me ka ʻ Proverbslelo Nūhou mokuna 8 e pili ana i ka naʻauao a me Iesū e noho mana ʻole inā ʻaʻole huikau a maopopo ʻole paha. Inā ʻaʻole kuhi ʻo Proverbs ʻohana 8 i ke ʻano o ke akamai a he ʻano maoli ia a laila pehea e hoʻoholo ai i ka ʻōlelo a ka ʻōlelo noʻeau e pili ana i ka naʻauao e noho nei me ke akahele a i ʻole ka maʻalea ma ka lumi lumi lumi ʻ Proverbslelo Kūkākūkā mokuna 8:12. A pehea paha; ʻo ka mea pono, ʻo ka palaualelo, ʻo ka hūpō, ʻo ka mea haʻaheo, a ʻo ka mea lapuwale paha a pēlā aku. E hoʻoholo mākou i kēia ʻaʻole kekahi i ʻano o nā ʻano akā akā... Pākuhi hou »
ʻO ka naʻau i loaʻa iaʻu no ka ʻ Proverbslelo Pepelu he unuhi a no laila ke ʻae nei wau ʻaʻole hewa ia. Eia nō naʻe, ʻaʻole i hāʻawi ʻia ka Baibala ʻē aʻe i Pilipi 2: 5-8 e like me ka unuhi ʻana o ka Honua Hou. E hoʻomanaʻo, ʻo kēlā mau unuhi i kākau ʻia e nā poʻe Tritarians. He mea hoʻopilikia loa kēlā ala no kā lākou theology a he hiʻohiʻona nui loa no ka bias Trinitary. Aia kahi loiloi maikaʻi loa o kēlā paukū na Jason David DeBuhn ma ka ʻoiaʻiʻo a me ka unuhi. Inā makemake ʻoe e komo i ka grammar, ʻike ʻoe he maikaʻi loa kāna laina o ka noʻonoʻo ʻana. Ka Helene... Pākuhi hou »
Kahi hoihoi ʻia ka ʻike palapala. I ka manawa like, ʻaʻole wau manaʻo e hoʻopau i nā pilikia haipule a ʻaʻole paha he hopena i loko o kou manaʻo no ke ola mau loa. Ma kahi aʻu i ʻike maka ai, ʻaʻohe o nā Apotoro i aʻo i nā palapala a makemake ʻo ia e lilo i kumu kākau a me nā kumu o ke kānāwai. ʻAʻole i loaʻa kahi ʻatikala ʻē aʻe no ka lehulehu. Aʻo kēlā mau palapala i noho ʻia, na wai e hiki ke haʻi inā he pololei? ʻO nā ʻike a pau i lohe ʻia ma ka luakini a i kuʻi ʻia ma kekahi e kekahi. Ke waiho nei ka mea hewa... Pākuhi hou »
Ma hope loa i ka maopopo…!
ʻAe like wau me Eric a me Mr. Penton i koʻu manaʻoʻiʻo he akua ʻo Iesū - akā ʻoi aku ka maopopo he poʻe i waena o nā lunaʻōlelo i manaʻoʻiʻo pū kekahi. ʻAʻole hiki ke kānalua he akua ʻo Iesū. Lawe ʻia kahi akua e hoʻāla i ka mea make, hoʻōla i ka poʻe maʻi, hoʻōla i ka ʻoʻopa a me nā mea hou aku. E hoʻopaʻapaʻa paha kekahi ʻo ia ko mākou akua no ka manawa, a hiki i kēlā manawa hāʻawi ʻo ia i ka noho aliʻi iā ia... Pākuhi hou »
Aia kekahi manawa ʻaʻole hiki i nā lunaʻōlelo ke hana i nā hana mana kikoʻī a kāhea aku iā Iesū. Akā ʻaʻohe o nā lunaʻōlelo i hāpai i nā poʻo inoa e like me ia i ho'ākāka ʻia ma ʻIsaia 9 ... ʻo Iesū wale nō! Me ia a ke "Akua Mana." Ua kuhikuhi ʻo Iesū i ka mele 82 i ka wā i hoʻopiʻi ʻia ai No laila, pili ke "akua" ma nā pae like ʻole. ʻO ka mana e hana ai i nā mea kupaianaha, AOLE i hoʻohilohi i nā lunaʻōlelo! He akua ʻo Iesū, ʻoiai ʻaʻole ka Mana Loa. No laila, kāu kānalua, no ka pane i kaʻu kūlana he kānalua. E pili ana i kāu nīnau hope loa, ʻo ia ka mea pilikia (ʻoiai ʻoe e ʻōlelo nei i kahi kūlana e hāmau ʻole ka palapala hemolele),... Pākuhi hou »
Kahi manaʻo hope, ʻoluʻolu. ʻAʻole wau e noi ana e ʻae ʻoe i koʻu noʻonoʻo ʻana, ʻaʻole hoʻi e manaʻoʻiʻo i nā poʻe ʻē aʻe e manaʻo mai iaʻu. E lilo kēia i hoʻopaʻapaʻa kūkākūkā a me ka kūkākūkā hou ʻana iā mākou iho i ka wehe ʻana i ka ʻoiaʻiʻo o nā palapala hemolele. I ka hopena, manaʻoʻiʻo mākou i nā mea like a me nā kumu aʻoi o nā palapala hemolele. ʻAʻohe mea, mai koʻu ʻike, e ʻae i kēlā me kēia manaʻo, ʻaʻole hoʻi kekahi o mākou e manaʻo i kēlā me kēia manaʻo i kēlā me kēia papaʻano, no laila, e hoʻopili ʻia ana i ka hanohano iā mākou iho ma mua o ka Mana. I ka ʻōlelo ʻana, mahalo paha mākou... Pākuhi hou »
He mau pilikia kaʻu me ke kiʻina no ke kūkā e hiki mai ana; Manaʻo wau he pilikia ke kumuhana i hōʻike ʻia no nā kumu aʻe: 1. ʻ saylelo ʻoe; 'ʻo ka ʻōlelo akāka i loko o ka Baibala kekahi mea, ʻoiai ka wehewehe ʻana o ke kanaka i kekahi mea ʻē aʻe. He ʻōlelo kumuhana kēia i ka wanaʻao e kākoʻo i ka hihia āu e makemake ai e pale aku. ʻO ka heluhelu Baibala kahi hana 'unuhi' e nā mea heluhelu āpau o ka baibala. ʻO ka mea i ʻike ʻia ma ke ʻano he 'mōakāka' i kekahi kanaka e hoʻopaʻapaʻa paha i kekahi. No laila pono mākou e kali a hiki i ka manawa e kau ai ka 'lepo' a laila e hoʻoholo kēlā me kēia no lākou iho... Pākuhi hou »
Aloha, koʻu manaʻo ʻaʻole i loaʻa iā Iesū kahi ola ma mua o ke kanaka. ʻAʻole ʻo ia ka 'huaʻōlelo' i kamaʻilio ʻia ma John 1: 1, Pilipi, ʻ Proverbslelo Pepelu, Collosians a me kekahi mau palapala hemolele ʻē aʻe i hiki ke hoʻoholo ʻia e hōʻike ʻole iā Iesū ma ke ʻano he kanaka ma mua o ke kanaka. A ʻo ka noʻonoʻo ʻana i ka palapala hemolele ʻōlelo i kākau ʻia ma (Greek) a me nā nuances Hebraic maʻamau i kēlā manawa ʻaʻole e ala ka pilikia e pili ana iā Iesu ke ʻano akua. ʻO ka pale ʻana iā Iesū ma ke ʻano akua he paheʻe ia i ka Trinity. Manaʻo wau he dichotomy wahaheʻe e noʻonoʻo i ke Kahikolu a i ʻole ka manaʻo o ke Akua a me Iesū... Pākuhi hou »
@ Alithia Maikaʻi pono ʻoe e heluhelu: John 17: 1–11 (ESV): 17 A kamaʻilio ʻo Iesū i kēia mau ʻōlelo, hāpai aʻela ʻo ia i kona mau maka i ka lani, ʻī akula, E ka Makua, ua hiki mai ka hora; i hoonani aku i kau Keiki, i hoonani aku ai ke Keiki ia oe, 2 no ka mea, ua haawi aku oe ia ia i ka mana maluna o na io a pau, i mea e ola mau ai i na poe a pau au i haawi ai iaia. 3 Eia ke ola mau loa, i ike lakou ia oe, ke Akua oiaio a o Iesu Kristo au i hoouna aku ai. 4 Ua hoʻonani wau iā ʻoe ma ka honua nei, ua hoʻokō wau i ka hana āu i hāʻawi mai ai iaʻu e hana. OLELO:... Pākuhi hou »
E ke kaikuahine aloha ʻo Maria makemake wau e kau i kou maka iā John 17 āu e kuhikuhi ai a nānā i ka paukū 3, inā e ʻōlelo ʻia ʻo Iesū ʻo ia ka mea i 'hoʻouna ʻia'. ʻAʻole ia i kuhikuhi ʻia ʻo Iesū e hele mai ana mai ka lani, ʻo ia wale nō ka 'lani i hoʻouna ʻia' a i ʻole ke ala ʻana mai o kahi lani. He ʻokoʻa nui kēia, ʻaʻole pono kākou e heluhelu hou aʻe ma mua o ka mea i ʻōlelo ʻia ma aneʻi. Ma kēia wahi makemake wau e noʻonoʻo ʻoe iā Mareko mokuna 11:13 ma kahi a Iesu e hoʻopaʻapaʻa nei me nā alakaʻi haipule a ua nīnau ʻo ia iā lākou i kahi nīnau naʻaupō;... Pākuhi hou »
Mahalo i kāu pane.
Maria ?
Alithia, pono wau e heluhelu i ka pale o kou kūlana ma ka mālamalama o John 17: 5 i kekahi mau manawa ʻelua e ʻike i kāu noʻonoʻo. ʻAʻole maʻalahi ia e kiʻi. ʻOiai ma hope o ʻelua mau heluhelu ʻana, pilikia wau i ka ʻike ʻana i ke ʻano o ia mea. Makemake wau e hele me ka mea i ʻōlelo akāka ʻia inā mālama ia i ka ʻoluʻolu o ka Palapala Hemolele, ka hoʻomaopopo pololei o John 17: 5. Kūlike ia me Pilipi 2: 5-9 e like paha. Nui wale nā palapala hemolele e kākoʻo ana i ka manaʻoʻiʻo ua iho mai ʻo Iesū mai ka lani mai e mālama i kēlā ʻano aʻo no ka makemake ʻole i ka preexistence. Maopopo iaʻu... Pākuhi hou »
ʻO ka manaʻo o ka 'Unitarian' ʻo Iesū i hele mai i ke kino. A ʻoiai he kanaka wale nō ia i hele mai ai. ʻAʻole hiki i kahi ʻike ʻoi aku ka hōʻoia o Iesū e hele mai ana i ke kino ma mua o kēia hiki ma laila?
Manaʻo wau e waiho wau i laila akā hoʻolei i kēia manawa i nā mea o ka Trinity a me ke kumu o ke manaʻo nei kekahi e kākoʻo i kēia aʻo. Ke nānā nei wau i ka hoʻohemo ʻana.
Mahalo no ka pane.
Aloha i nā poʻe a pau mai Alithia
I ka hānau ʻana o kahi keiki, ʻaʻole mākou e ʻōlelo e hele ua keiki ke kino. He ʻōlelo ia ʻole. Hele e hele mai kahi e hele ai ma kahi ʻē. Ke ʻole o kahi noho mua, he pau ʻole kēia ʻōlelo.
Aloha Alithia, he wehewehe maikaʻi kēlā no Ioane 17: 5.
Nui kaʻu mau mea e ʻōlelo ai e pili ana i kēia kumuhana a e kau ana ke hiki. I kēia manawa makemake wau e hōʻike iā ʻoe i kahi kākoʻo. 🙂 ʻAʻole wau e kūʻē i kekahi a makemake ʻole wau e mahalo i nā manaʻo ʻē aʻe akā ʻo kēia nō koʻu ʻike.
Aloha Nightingale, manaʻo wau hiki i kekahi ke hoʻokolokolo no lākou iho, ma ka hoʻohālikelike ʻana i kaʻu mau manaʻo, nā pane i loaʻa iaʻu, e ʻike i ka hoʻokō kūpaʻa ʻole i nā manaʻo i kākoʻo ʻole ʻia e ka scripturaly. Hoʻokahi rebuttal ka 'hoʻopaʻapaʻa' hoʻopaʻapaʻa e kākoʻo i ka ʻike Unitarian. Eia nō naʻe ke ʻike nei au i nā 'paio hou aʻe' e kipaku i ka henotheistic ʻike.
ʻO "Word," (a i ʻole Grk Logos) ka mea nui ma aneʻi (ma John 1: 1)… he mea hoihoi ia, ʻoiai he nui nā haneli o nā hoʻohana ma loko o nā moʻolelo baibala OT a me NT me ka ʻole o ka capitalization. ʻO Logos lit ke ʻano o ka "plan of God," a i ʻole "makemake o ke Akua." Ke manaʻoʻiʻo nei paha wau ʻo ka lunaʻōlelo John ("inā" ua kākau ʻo ia i kēlā mau huaʻōlelo - ke nīnau nei nā loea ʻepekema ʻoi aku ka pololei o ka mōʻaukala o John), e hoʻohana ana ʻo John i ka "Word" ma ke ʻano he personification, e like me ka "naʻauao" i hoʻohana ʻia ma Prov 8. E hoʻolālā iā IS God, a i ʻole i kona makemake (i loko o kēia moʻolelo) lawe mai ʻo ia i ka Mesia (kahi Logos a "Word" paha -... Pākuhi hou »
ʻO "Word," (a i ʻole Grk Logos) kahi mea i kākau ʻia ma aneʻi (ma John 1: 1)… he mea hoihoi ia, ʻoiai he nui nā haneli o ka hoʻohana ʻana ma waena o nā moʻolelo baibala ʻo OT a me NT me ka ʻole o ka capitalization. ʻO Logos lit ka manaʻo o "ke kumumanaʻo o ke Akua," a i ʻole "makemake o ke Akua." Ke manaʻoʻiʻo nei paha wau ʻo ka lunaʻōlelo John ("inā" ua kākau ʻo ia i kēlā mau huaʻōlelo - ke nīnau nei nā loea ʻepekema ʻoi aku ka pololei o ka mōʻaukala o John), e hoʻohana ana ʻo John i ka "Word" ma ke ʻano he personification, e like me ka "naʻauao" i hoʻohana ʻia ma Prov 22. E like me ka mea e hiki ai i kekahi ke ʻōlelo, "He ʻEkamai ke Akua," hiki i kekahi ke ʻōlelo "He hoʻolālā ke Akua, a e makemake paha" - no nā mea āpau a ke Akua e hana ai... Pākuhi hou »
Ke hoʻoponopono ʻana: ʻO ke akamai i ʻike ʻia e like me Iesū ma loko o ke ʻano wahine he Hulikole pene 8. . ^ E Ha yM. .mole bab 22
MAI MAI? Ua hāʻawi ʻoe iaʻu i kahi "ʻino" (ma luna) no ke kau ʻana i kahi hoʻoponopono? Unreal.
E hele mai i Rusticshore, pono ʻoe e ʻae i ka heluhelu ʻana o ka poʻe i kāu mea. ʻO ka hapa nui o ka manawa ʻaʻole wau e ʻike inā lilo kekahi i kekona kekona e heluhelu ana i kaʻu mau pou. Ua hauʻoli wau i kāu mau pou. Makemake au i ka ʻoki o ia mea āpau. Akā e noʻonoʻo pono ʻaʻole like ka manaʻo o nā poʻe āpau me aʻu. E hoʻomau i ka hoʻouka kaikuaʻana. Pono ʻoe e lawe i nā mea me kahi paʻakai o ka paʻakai ma aneʻi me kēia kumuhana no ka mea he mahana loa ia. E lawe au i kahi 'maikaʻi ʻole' ma mua o ka ʻoki ʻana i ke poʻo a i ʻole ke kuni ʻana i ka pahu... Pākuhi hou »
ʻAʻole wau i manaʻoʻiʻo ʻo Iesū ia, a i ʻole he ʻānela. ʻAʻole wau i manaʻoʻiʻo ʻo Iesū ka "ʻānela o ka Haku" i ʻōlelo ʻia, ma kahi laʻana, i nā Kānāwai. ʻO Iesū ma mua kahi kumuhana ʻē aʻe me nā hoʻopaʻapaʻa lōʻihi i kau ʻia. maluhia
E like me ka mea i ʻōlelo ʻia, pili mau ka puke a Ioane iā Iesū e kuhikuhi nei iā ia iho me he mea lā e nānā aku. E hoʻohālikelike i kēlā me nā ʻelele synoptic, ka mea e kuhikuhi nui iā Iesū e kuhikuhi ana i ka manaʻo o ka poʻe i ka Makua. Hoʻohui ʻia, nui nā ʻano kūpilikiʻi lehulehu i loaʻa, a ke hoʻomau nei e ʻike ʻia ma o ka leka a John (malia paha he moreso ma mua o ka awelika). ʻOiai, ʻike ʻia nā ʻano mea liʻiliʻi a koʻikoʻi hoʻi i nā puke āpau - ʻoiaʻiʻo he kuleana nui kā John! A ʻaʻole pili kēia mau mea i ka homeoteleuton maʻamau a i ʻole nā haʻi wahaheʻe… akā ʻo ka hana hewa ʻana a me ka makemake ʻole. E pili ana i ka palapala a Ioane... Pākuhi hou »
Aloha Jim me Eric,
Mahalo, no kahi wikiō, nui ka ʻike a kōkua hoʻi e hoʻomaopopo i ke aʻo ʻana o ke Trinity. I kekahi mau lā wale nō i hala aku nei ke kūkākūkā nei wau me kekahi kāne e pili ana i ke aʻo ʻana o Trinity a he kōkua maikaʻi kāu wikiō no ke kūkākūkā e hiki mai ana. Ke kali nei wau i kāu mau wikiō ʻē aʻe.