[This is a review of highlights from this week’s Watchtower study (w13 12/15 p.11). Please feel free to share your own insights using the Comments feature of the Beroean Pickets Forum.]
Rather than a paragraph-by-paragraph analysis of the article as we have done in the past, I would like to consider this article thematically. The focus of the article is on the sacrifices that we make as Christians. As the basis for this, it draws parallels with the sacrifices Jews made in ancient Israel. (See paragraphs 4 through 6.)
These days, I find a little alarm bell goes off in my brain anytime an article purporting to teach us something about Christianity is based on the Jewish system of things. I wonder why we are going yet again to the tutor when the master teacher has already arrived? Let us do a little analysis of our own. Open up the Watchtower Library program and enter “sacrific*” into the search box—without the quotation marks, of course. The asterisk will allow you to find “sacrifice, sacrifices, sacrificing, and sacrificial”. If you discount appendix references, you get 50 occurrences of the word in the entirety of the Christian Greek Scriptures. If you discount the book of Hebrews in which Paul spends a lot of time discussing the Jewish system of things so as to illustrate the superiority of the sacrifice that Jesus made, you end up with 27 occurrences. However, in this single Watchtower article alone the word sacrifice occurs 40 times.
As Jehovah’s Witnesses, we are urged over and over again to make sacrifices. Is this really a valid exhortation? Is the emphasis we put on this in keeping with the message of the good news of the Christ? Let’s look at this another way. The book of Matthew uses the word “sacrifice” only twice and yet it has 10 times the word count of this single article that uses it 40 times. I do not think it is outrageous to suggest that we are overemphasizing the Christian need to make sacrifices.
Since you have already got the Watchtower Library program open, why not scan through every occurrence in the Christian Greek Scriptures of the word. For your convenience I have extracted those which do not have to do with references to the Jewish system of things nor to the sacrifice Christ made on our behalf. The following are sacrifices that Christians make.
(Romans 12:1, 2) . . .Therefore, I appeal to you by the compassions of God, brothers, to present your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and acceptable to God, a sacred service with your power of reason. 2 And stop being molded by this system of things, but be transformed by making your mind over, so that you may prove to yourselves the good and acceptable and perfect will of God.
The context of Romans indicates that we are the sacrifice. Like Jesus who gave his all, even to his human life, we likewise surrender ourselves to the will of our Father. We are not here speaking about the sacrifice of things, our time and money, but of our very selves.
(Philippians 4:18) . . .However, I have everything I need and even more. I am fully supplied, now that I have received from E·paph·ro·di′tus what you sent, a sweet fragrance, an acceptable sacrifice, well-pleasing to God.
Apparently a gift was made to Paul through Epaphroditus; a sweet smelling, acceptable sacrifice, something pleasing to God. Whether it was a material contribution, or something else, we cannot say with certainty. So a gift made to someone in need can be considered a sacrifice.
(Hebrews 13:15) . . .Through him let us always offer to God a sacrifice of praise, that is, the fruit of our lips that make public declaration to his name. .
This scripture is often used to support the idea that our field ministry is a sacrifice. But that is not what is being addressed here. There are two ways of looking at any sacrifice to God. One is that it is a means to praise God as indicated here in Hebrews; the other, that it is a legal or necessary requirement. One is given joyfully and willingly while the other is given because one is expected to do so. Are both of equal value to God? A Pharisee would answer, Yes; for they considered that righteousness could be achieved through works. Nevertheless, this “sacrifice of praise… the fruit of our lips” is made ‘through Jesus’. If we are to imitate him, we can hardly imagine obtaining sanctification by means of works, for he did not do this.
In fact, Paul continues by saying, “Moreover, do not forget to do good and to share what you have with others, for God is well-pleased with such sacrifices.”[i] Christ never forgot to do what was good and whatever he had he shared with others. He encouraged others to give to the poor.[ii]
It is therefore obvious that a Christian who shares of his time and wealth with others in need is making a sacrifice that is acceptable to God. However, the focus in the Christian Greek Scriptures is not on the sacrifice itself as if by works one can buy one’s way to salvation. Rather, the focus is on motivation, heart condition; specifically, love of God and neighbor.
A superficial read of the article might suggest to the reader that this is the very same message being expounded in this week’s study.
However, consider the opening remarks of paragraph 2:
“Certain sacrifices are fundamental for all true Christians and are essential to our cultivating and maintaining a good relationship with Jehovah. Such sacrifices include devoting personal time and energy to prayer, Bible reading, family worship, meeting attendance, and the field ministry.”
I was hoping to find something in the Christian Scriptures that associated prayer, Bible reading, meeting attendance, or our worship of God with sacrifice. To me, considering prayer or Bible reading as a sacrifice because of the time we devote to it would be like considering sitting down to a fine meal as a sacrifice because of the time it takes for us to eat it. God has given me a gift by the opportunity I have of speaking directly to him. He has given me a gift of his wisdom as expressed in the holy Scriptures by which I can live a better, more fruitful life and even attain to everlasting life. What is the message I am imparting to my heavenly father with regard to these gifts if I consider their use to be a sacrifice?
I’m sorry to say that this overemphasis on sacrifice as presented in our magazines often serves to create feelings of guilt and worthlessness. As the Pharisees of Jesus’ day did, we continue to bind heavy burdens on the disciples, burdens we are often not willing to carry ourselves.[iii]
The Crux of the Article
It will be evident to even a casual reader that the thrust of this article is to promote the sacrifice of our time and money toward disaster relief efforts and the building of Kingdom Halls. Being against either of these two pursuits is like being against puppy dogs and little children.
The first century Christians did engage in disaster relief as paragraphs 15 and 16 point out. As to the building of Kingdom Halls there is no record in the Bible. However, one thing is for sure: Whatever monies were used to construct or provide places of meeting, and whatever funds were donated for disaster relief, they were not channeled through and controlled by some centralized authority in Jerusalem or elsewhere.
When I was a child we met at the Legion Hall, which we rented on a monthly basis for our meetings. I remember that when we first started building Kingdom Halls, some thought it was an outrageous waste of time and money given that the end was going to come at any time. In the 70s when I served in Latin America, there were very few Kingdom Halls. Most congregations met in the homes of some well-to-do brothers who rented out or donated the use of the first floor.
Back in those days, if you wanted to build a Kingdom Hall you got the brothers of the congregation together, gathered what funds you could, then started to work. It was very much a labor of love run at the local level. Toward the end of the 20th century all that changed. The Governing Body instituted the Regional Building Committee arrangement. The idea was to have skilled brothers in the building trades oversee the work and take the pressure off the local congregation. In time the whole process became very institutionalized. It is no longer possible for a congregation to go it alone. It is now a requirement to build or renovate a kingdom Hall through the RBC. The RBC will take charge of the entire affair, schedule it according to their own timetable, and control the funds. In fact, the congregation that tries to go it alone, even if they have the skill set and the funds, will get into trouble with head office.
Around the turn-of-the-century a similar process came into effect with regard to disaster relief. This is now all controlled through a central organizational structure. I’m not being critical of this process nor am I promoting it. These are simply the facts as I understand them.
If you donate your time as a skilled professional in the building of Kingdom Halls or the repair of structures damaged by some disaster, you are in effect donating money. The result of your efforts is a tangible asset which will continue to grow in value as the real estate market inflates.
If you contribute your money to a worldly charity, you have every right to know how the money is being used; to ensure that your funds are being put to the best use.
If we follow the money that is donated either directly or through contributed labor to relief efforts or the building of Kingdom Halls, where does it end up? With regard to Kingdom Halls, the obvious answer is, in the hands of the local congregation since they own the Kingdom Hall. I had always believed this to be the case. However, recent events have surfaced in the media leading me to question the validity of this assumption. I am therefore asking for some insight from our readership as to what really is the case. Let me paint a scenario: Say a congregation owns a Kingdom Hall that through the rise of real estate values is now worth $2 million. (Many Kingdom Halls in the North America are worth far more than this.) Let us say that some bright minds in the congregation realize that they can sell the Kingdom Hall, use half of the money to alleviate the suffering of several destitute families in the congregation and contribute to local charities or even open one themselves so as to provide for the poor in the spirit of Jesus’ disciples.[iv] The other half of the money would be put into a bank account where it could earn 5% a year. The resulting $50,000 would be used to pay the rental on a place of meeting much as we did back in the 50s. Some have suggested that if anything like this were to be attempted, the body of elders would be removed and the congregation dissolved, whereby the publishers would be dispatched to neighboring Kingdom Halls. Then, the branch would appoint the local RBC to sell the property. Does anyone know of a situation where something like this has happened? Something that would prove who really owns the property and Kingdom Hall of any and all congregations?
Along similar lines, and again in the vein of making sure our money is being used wisely, one has to wonder how disaster relief works when the properties we are repairing our insured or are in line to receive federal disaster relief funds, as was the case in New Orleans. Brothers donate materials. Brothers donate money. Brothers donate their labor and skills. Who does the insurance money go to? To whom does the federal government send the funds earmarked for disaster relief? If anyone can give a definitive answer to this question, we would very much like to know.
Archived Comments
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Comment by imacountrygirl2 on 2014-02-10 18:31:18
"Possibly the one positive note for the Watchtower was the dismissal of a federal lawsuit filed by the former elders of the Menlo Park (California) Kingdom Hall. Although the lawsuit failed and three elders involved were all later disfellowshipped, the extensive and well-documented trial transcripts became publicly available, clearly exposing the Watchtower’s power and intent to grab control and ownership of all North American Kingdom Halls – even existing Halls that are privately owned and were locally financed. Some of the evidence in the trial transcripts was quite revealing beyond the focus of the trial. During testimony a Watchtower attorney made one damning statement that contradicted the Watchtower’s claim that they were different from all other religions when he testified, “[as a hierarchy] we are no different from the Catholic Church.” Read the court records for yourself at http://ex-jw.com/menlo-park-elder-tells-all-1
The was part of a report on some of the things involving Jehovah's Witnesses during the year 2012, which are also very revealing about the direction of the GB. http://watchtowerwatch.com/blog/2012-bad-year-for-watchtowerReply by Meleti Vivlon on 2014-02-10 18:52:15
Actually, the Menlo Park case is still active, and the WB&TS is being charged under RICO.
Comment by GodsWordisTruth on 2014-02-10 18:33:37
Wow! The points you made regarding how our building work is funded/spent are definitely valid. I never even thought about that. I always found it curious that congregations have to provide details of their finances to the WTBS however the WTBS provides no transparency regarding the their finances. The yearbook in my opinion is a great place to put this information.It could be placed alongside the pages and pages of year end totals of hours mags rv's etc. I realize that the WTBS actually implementing that is wishful thinking.
Reply by Dorcas on 2014-02-10 18:45:48
I think it's time more of us start learning some of these things for ourselves. I know I have been very, very naive over the years.
It's been my long-standing belief that we are off the mark with our ideas of sacrifice, service, charities and what constitutes doing good to our neighbors. Last week I was food shopping with another Witness. The person in front of us tried to use a debit card and it would not take her card. I handed her $20. The Witness with me asked why I did that. I said, she's hungry and doesn't have money to get the food she tried to buy. (huh?) Why would I do that?
Just google Menlo Park congregation of Jehovah's Witnesses for a real eye opener that paints a murky picture of how things really work concerning our real estate, Kingdom Hall ownership.
On a lighter note, Meleti, can you please tell me where I can invest my money to get 5% interest. Hahaha.Reply by Meleti Vivlon on 2014-02-10 18:57:51
Easy. You just start up your own gambling casino. ;)
Reply by on 2014-02-11 17:28:11
I personally know of no instance where a pioneer in need received any financial assitance either from the Branch or the local congregation. In fact, the congregations pay for everything; C.O. expenses; food for all the schools; even air fare to bring missionaries back from their foreign assignments for conventions. It gets to the point where enough is enough!
Comment by Chris on 2014-02-10 18:41:22
I don't know if it's the same incident that you are alluding to Meleti but the sale of the Spanish Bethel comes to mind.
It seems many in Spain were upset that they financed the whole construction, as the society couldn't afford it at the time, but the WTS coffers have benefited entirely from the sale.
Particularly since Rutherfords day this whole concept of sacrifice is geared to serving Jehovah by means of an organization.
Rutherford poured scorn on the idea that we should strive for a Christian personality, instead placing the emphasis on preaching works.
It would been difficult for a man of his now renowned excesses to speak about Christ-like conduct without his conscience bothering him no doubt.
Comment by JimmyG on 2014-02-11 03:16:43
The Bethel complex in the country I live in was sold to the Elim Church. Similar to Chris' comment, this complex was built labour free by local Witnesses and was no doubt sold at a huge profit compared to the actual cost of building it in the mid 1980's. Where has this money gone? It seems it ok to take Christendom's money when it comes to selling real estate, but watch out if you're a painter and you're seen painting a church! You can't take money from Christendom!
What's happened to the one billion dollars from New York real estate sales? Do I hear the words 'hedge funds'?Reply by Chris on 2014-02-11 04:56:52
We must live in the same country JG :)
The previous Bethel was also sold to a religious group, from memory it was the SDA.
A kingdom hall in my city was also sold to the Exclusive Brethren about 6 years ago.
Many years back an elder who was a painter did some work on a Catholic School and was publicly reproved.
It's one set of rules for the rule makers and they determine who are the rule breakers.
Does the word Pharisees fit?
Reply by kev on 2014-02-12 05:21:02
Thats amazing brothets so if babylon the great has fallen we have helped to build it back up again
Comment by on 2014-02-11 04:38:08
It is such a delight to have discovered this blog, such a refreshment. Your analysis is spot on! Having toiled since my youth (I am now 51) with "sacrifices", having been made to feel with every meeting that I am unworthy and must make more "sacrifices", feeling totally incapable because of not "sacrificing" enough, reading your article has peeled the heavy scales fall off my eyes, quite literarily. The beauty of light is so powerful that I have been all but knocked over!
What else can one say?
Comment by JimmyG on 2014-02-11 05:17:03
Likely so Chris. Three KHs that I know of in my vicinity have been sold to churches.
One other thing I remember about the press release regarding the sale of the Bethel complex. The WT media spokesman declared that it was good that the facility had been sold to a 'faith based group' and that it would benefit the local people, or words to that effect. It seems a strange thing for a JW spokesman to say about a church that is supposedly part of false religion.
As George Orwell said in 'Animal Farm'-, 'some animals are more equal than others'...
Comment by GodsWordisTruth on 2014-02-11 06:23:41
That's funny you guys mentioned the sales of KH's to churches . I can remember a KH being sold to a church many years ago in my old neighborhood. My sister and I were out in service one day. This lady was receptive to my sister's presentation. The lady proceeded to said she loved our work and that she attends one of the churches we are apart of up the street. My sister and I looked at each other trying not to laugh because we knew it was was now a church. She invited us to a revival there.
Although my sister and I thought it was hilarious (it was a slow day out in service) .I'm not sure why that lady thought it was a KH when the sign clearly had been changed :)
Jimmy G, The WT spokesperson said It's a good thing that KH was sold to a faith based group? Since when are we tolerant of other religions? Apparently we are when money is involved.
I'm confused. After a congregation pays off their mortgage to the society... They still do not own the Kingdom Hall? Does anyone know why a congregation pays interest on these "loans " when the money being loaned comes from donations?Reply by kev on 2014-02-11 09:34:30
Yeah its the only mortgage company i know where you pay off the mortgage and the mortgage company still owns the building at the end . When the mortgage was paid off they wanted to sell the hall and move us out the area and share with 2 other congregations many off us built that hall personally .When the brothers got upset they decided to hold a secret ballot and got the brothers to vote on it .the ballot paper was the most.biased ballot paper ive ever read it went something like this .Do you agree to uphold the recommendation by the elders that the hall be sold . Someone even made the comment at the meeting that those who voted against were guilty of apostasy .we were told it was gods will and the hall was dedicated funds the credit crunch seemed to change his mind though ..and the brothers still voted against and stayed .Dont know if that was a legal requirement or not .Theres much more on this story that im not saying that i found really disturbing actually . The poor brothers go outside the hall to discuss buisness matters out of respect for gods house and then the whole house itself is sold off at some auction to the highest bidder .Could you imagine the jews flogging the temple off for a profit in bible times .
Reply by GodsWordisTruth on 2014-02-11 11:52:01
Wow Kev!
Comment by Vassy on 2014-02-11 07:06:44
Meleti's review of the WT article brings to my mind two important issues that I've been thinking of for a long time:
1. If a KH has once been DEDICATED TO JEHOVAH, how is it possible that, after many years, it ends up being SOLD, and even to Christendom churches? That is outrageous! When a KH is built, much ado is made about Jehovah's blessing His work etc etc. But when it is SOLD....of course, other childish reasons are presented. But I wonder, if Jehovah really blesses our work, how comes that we have to SELL a property that officially belongs to Jehovah?
2. Speaking of sacrifices and the field ministry, is there any evidence that the first century 'rank and file' (to use the WTS' terminology in Candace's trial) brothers took part in the field service, as did appointed missionaries? Because I found none of the sort.Reply by Alex Rover on 2014-02-11 11:36:07
When the elders sold my old, tiny, but cherished hall to an evangelical group I was gutted. I didn't understand how this was possible. I still don't.
Same as going to a rented district convention hall and have the US flag spot hung in the center from the ceiling, because the building doesn't want to take it down. This is less an issue for Americans who grew up in US, because they got SO used to seeing this flag everywhere. In my country of origin, we took down our national flag when we rented a hall for the memorial. It's the right thing to do! Jehovah is jealous.
Also my hall had saved nearly enough money to buy their own hall. Took them 16 years. Then RBC came in and asked us to donate to another congregation who needed a hall more urgently. The elders agreed and a congregation vote was made.
Then the RBC proposed a mega hall construction. Now we share our room in the hall with 4 other congregations and are paying for the loan, but the building is owned by the society.
I guess it all should be this way to maintain union and control.
Imagine we are all in the same hall as Meleti and Apollos, and the society would not be able to take our hall. Then we could continue to worship Jehovah in spirit and truth and even go out and preach the real good news. Wouldn't that be a dream come true?
Our bibles are copyright, our songs too. So we wouldn't be allowed to play kingdom melodies. This thought recently bothered me. They own their translation. In fact, they might even sue this website because it has too many unauthorized quotes from their copyrighted literature. Imagine that, taking copy rights on Gods word! They own it.
I now use the WEB and OEB translations. They are fully open source and you are even allowed to make your own bible version by improving on their work.
Comment by John on 2014-02-11 11:02:33
RE: Insurance payments to the congregation
I live in the Gulf Coast Area, USA so we see our fair share of damage from hurricanes. During Hurricane Katrina, there were a number of Kingdom Halls and homes of Brothers/Sisters damaged.
The society sent disaster relief, making sure that building materials, food, clothing, and qualified brothers were sent to aid us. Most of these materials were donated by brothers from unaffected areas at very little cost to the society. Due to the love of the brothers and sisters, our Kingdom Halls and homes were repaired well before any insurance money was received, which was a considerable benefit because many of us could not afford these repairs until receiving the insurance money.
After such repairs were made, the instruction was to donate any insurance money received to the Worldwide Work Fund to further fund similar work and cover the cost of the relief aid that had been provided. Many of us were receiving $10,000+ for the cost of new roofing, etc. - much more money than any stake the WTBTS had in the relief due to the amount of donated supplies and work.
Although I'm grateful for the relief and timely repairs, it is easy to see how the WTBTS benefits from this more-so than the R&F because although the WTBTS organized the relief, it was the R&F that provided their time, money, and resources for free yet it is the WTBTS that receive all the insurance money through donations to the Worldwide Work.Reply by Meleti Vivlon on 2014-02-11 11:11:23
Thank you, John, for confirming what we believed to be the case.
Reply by GodsWordisTruth on 2014-02-11 12:01:32
Hi John,
Was this a "suggested" donation? Or did the WTBS imply that they were entitled to the money? I guess I'm wondering how you sent the insurance money to the WTBS?
As you stated the brothers were grateful. However this idea that the WTBS recieves freely but does not give freely..... Seems wrong. It feels unethical and unchristian.Reply by John on 2014-02-11 12:57:17
This was a "suggested" donation only to those receiving aid, and as such was never mentioned from the platform. For my family, we had damage to our roof and during the course of repairs, and elder mentioned that the Society had recommended that the brothers/sisters receiving aid for which they were also receiving insurance payments should donate the insurance funds to cover the cost of the work.
It was left to the discretion of the R&F as to how much of that to donate based on their understanding of how much of the money was to be used for certain purposes. For example, some families received money for their roof, loss of contents, etc. They were only "unofficially" expected to donate the money that would have went to repairing the roof if that was the only assistance provided by the WTBTS. The other money for loss of contents, etc was to be used by the individual as they saw fit.
The rationale was that the individual would have spent this money for repairs and be paid out to a worldly person, whereas this money has now been freed up and can be used to further kingdom interests.
With all things WTBTS related, these were only "suggestions" but we should call it what it really is, an expectation. As mentioned, these funds were all donated through the Worldwide Work box at our local Kingdom Hall. It was obvious what these funds were when you had checks for multiple thousands of dollars being placed into the contribution box. I don't know what instruction the accounts servant had based on these checks. For example, I don't know if he submitted these funds along with the Worldwide Work, or if these were removed from the fund based on an educated guess, and submitted under a separate fund.Reply by kev on 2014-02-12 04:25:44
Im not being funny but this is just not the right spirit of giving .It sounds more like christmas to me .I know someone who cut someone else off after recieving a gift that wasnt up to the same standard as the one they bought . All stories like this do is make people question the motive for giving in the first place ..I hope the brothers were not on another guilt trip after having the work done . I would ask at this point did they repair the houses of non jehovahs witnesses as well out of human compassion they would be less likely to hand the insurance money over thats real good samaritan stuff . I really do commend the spirit of the brothers who helped though wonderful thats what christianity is about to me kev
Reply by kev on 2014-02-12 04:42:17
I think the other unfortunate thing about this is that the society would know whose house has been repaired and also who had given over the money it would have to be a check or a bank transfer in the persons name .no ones going to put thousands in a contribution box
Reply by on 2014-02-16 08:53:39
Hello John
I've worked with a RBC for 8 years now. I can also confirm that this practice of donating the insurance money back is the case. I find it disturbing because it would seem that the Branch office actually profits from disasters as they put out very little and receive back the insurance money. It would be better spent helping out the brothers who came to help or other local families. I've been very concerned about this for some time.
The situation regarding KH loans is also disturbing.
For example, imagine buying a home, taking out a mortgage, paying off the mortgage and at the end the bank owns the home. All the while you have paid for maintenance, insurance, utilities etc. Do you think such a situation is fair?
This is the situation regarding Khs though. The local brothers carry all the burden yet do not seem to get the benefits from it. Unless of course you sell the KH in order to build a new hall. Then it seems the value can be transferred to the new one.
It brings to mind a situation I remember here. A local congregation took out a loan to pay for a renovation. The WT loaned the money. The congregation fell behind on the payments. After several letters were sent to the congregation, the Branch sent the Chairman of the RBC to give a talk that if the loan was not paid the KH would be sold to recoup the loan. I thought to myself we are no better than a bank.
I have seen a lot of abuses in the system. Even at times some fraudulent schemes. (Those brothers were removed). Should we be surprised? I suppose not. Judas became greedy and sold our Lord for 30 silver pieces. Still the ease which these things can take place is frightening. Since then I have stopped contributing financially. I give my time and energy to those who need it. At least this way I can see the fruitage of the work done and I know where the efforts are directed to. I cannot say the same when I dropped money into the contribution box.
Comment by miken on 2014-02-11 12:32:54
"It seems many in Spain were upset that they financed the whole construction, as the society couldn’t afford it at the time, but the WTS coffers have benefited entirely from the sale"
An account of the closure of the Spanish facility can be accessed at:-
http://www.anthonymathenia.com/spanish-jws-upset-over-bethel-move/.
I am not sure if the sale funds went to the society or not.Reply by JimmyG on 2014-02-11 15:14:46
That's the trouble Miken, no one really knows what happens to the money. It appears to just go into a big slush fund. The WT's balance sheet is a big mystery. Remember that it all originates from donations, but the WT behaves like a big commercial corporation.
They may be stockpiling now in anticipation of multiple pay outs in the coming years for the child abuse cases against the WT waiting to go through the US justice system.Reply by Chris on 2014-02-11 22:25:26
The article is similar to the one I read but as an aside it raises the issue of the society's legal obligation under law to look after volunteers.
Seeing as the WTS is so fond of citing scriptural 'principles' from the Mosaic Law I am sure they will be aware of their responsibilities to the young, infirm & elderly ;)Reply by Chris on 2014-02-11 23:25:49
Sorry, should have read " legal obligation under Caesars Law"
Comment by kev on 2014-02-11 14:43:21
On giving money and working on a project lets say KH i think its important to get the right balance ..we have to ask who is the money going to ive heard scriptures like acts 4 v 34 and 35 qouted to encourage the brothers to give to the society when the context reveals that the money was for the poor and the needy .However it is certainly not wrong to give to those who provide spirtual instruction Matthew 10 v10 the worker deserves his food or wages this is also the gist of 1 corinthians 9 although paul did not make use of this provision as he put it .The truth is if we really appreciate what people do for us we will respond in the right way . I think of the elders who give up their time and energy voluntary at personal cost but recieve nothing from the congregation this goes against 1 timothy 5 v 17 and 18 . Also if you have skills in construction like i do it seems almost expected that you must volunteer for KH building projects .qouted scriptures include those about josiahs restoration of the temple project to prove that we need to volunteer 2 kings 22 but a look at the context reveals that while the general populace gave the money verse 5 and 6 shows that it was spent on materials and the labour costs incured by the workers .There is a general rule here and its straight from the mouth of jesus The worker deserves their wages .kev
Comment by JohnAmos on 2014-02-11 17:05:30
In regards to all the comments having to do with Kingdom Hall’s being sold to Churches, the KH that I attended also was sold to a church. It was a KH from about the late 70’s/earlier 80’s until about 2006 when they sold it to a church. The church had to do a little renovating first before they could use it. I guess it’s like their version of having a satellite dish…LOL :)
Put
6203 Sheldon Road, Tampa, FL 33615
into Google search to see the picture.Reply by JohnAmos on 2014-02-11 17:24:58
Funny how the WTS/GB claim that the preaching work of JW’s is suppose to be the fulfillment in Joel of them being the military force of insects that are causing the fulfillment of
“Storehouses have been laid desolate. Barns have been torn down, for [the] grain has dried up. O how the domestic animal has sighed! [How] the droves of cattle have wandered in confusion! For there is no pasturage for them.”
And yet there is no evidence of any Churches closing down on account of JW’s but to the contrary, JW’s actually sell their KH’s to Churches.
5-1-98 WT
[The modern-day locust army is none other than the military force of Jehovah’s anointed locusts, now joined by some 5,600,000 of Jesus’ “other sheep.” (John 10:16)]
[When the “priests” of Christendom see Jehovah’s people in action and hear their warning of divine judgment, they become frantic. They beat their breasts in vexation and rage at the devastating effect of the Kingdom message. And they howl as their flocks slip away from them. With their pastures being denuded, let them spend the night in sackcloth, mourning over their loss of income. Before long, they will lose their jobs too! In fact, God tells them to mourn all night because their end is near.]
Comment by imacountrygirl2 on 2014-02-12 05:14:27
kev, In reference to your comment "There is a general rule here and its straight from the mouth of jesus The worker deserves their wages", I am curious about your meaning. Who exactly are the workers you are referring to? What kind of work are they doing? How much money do they deserve? Who are they working for?
I mean no disrespect and perhaps I misunderstand your comment. If so I sincerely apologize.Reply by kev on 2014-02-12 06:41:28
No problem sister in the case of matthew 10 You will notice that jesus was sending his disciples out to preach and teach the good news of the kingdom he gave them instructions on what to do .in verse 1 it says that they recieved authority from jesus to expel demons and cure people this was a power that was freely given by jesus to his disciples . Verse 8 shows that they could not charge others for this service but in verse 9 jesus then instructs them to take no provision for the mission work why . It is because the worker deserves his food or wage how would this be provided then Verse 11 shows that they were to search out who was deserving in the village and stay in their home so those who appreciated the message and the work would provide for the brothers physical needs . In another account at luke 10 v 7 jesus instructs his That the workers of the harvest ie the preachers of his message must stay in the house eating and drinking the things provided because the worker is worthy of his wages . At 1 corinthians 9 verse 14 paul alluded to this statement of jesus when he said in this way to the lord ordained for those proclaiming the good news to live by means of the good news and the way he was speaking of was the Example of the mosaic law where the levite preists had a right to be provided for because of the service they provided for the general populace .At 1 timothy 5 and verse 17 and 18 paul reiterates this principle toward the elders in the congregation especially those who work hard at preaching and teaching The point being if we really appreciate the sacrifice a brother is making on behalf of the good news we would make some provision to help that brother with his need also to make a living .as regards 2 kings 22 i really dont think that the craftsman and and the builders were expected to do all that work for nothing it was their trade their means of living the contributions provided by the general populace would have took care of them just as they did for the levites who worked in and around the temple when it was finished . Sorry its so long but i think my point is that i think we are expected to do most thing on a purely voluntry basis in gods service but the bible seems to show to me anyway that isnt the case kev
Reply by kev on 2014-02-12 07:55:49
Also a little observation about this this may be the reason why so many of the elders are overworked stressed out and ill just as i was kev
Reply by Alex Rover on 2014-02-12 09:18:29
Kev's point has biblical grounds:
Levites got the assignment to work on Jehovah's tabernacle.
They were not allowed to work the land, instead, the 12 other tribes provided their 10% of the best they had, the first fruits. This included money and food.
Even when they retired at 50, Israel would take care of them. 20 years of full time service warranted lifelong support. (30 yrs after king David)
Workers to the branch office are given this treatment while they are in bethel, but by large - are replaced if they get sick or old.
Many CO who were getting older, have recently been reassigned to congregations as special pioneers. The society leaves congregation to pay for their old age expenses, the stipend is not enough to live from. I stopped donating in the worldwide fund and help them instead now. Thirty years in full time service and they are cut off.
And my elders are poor. They are one income families where the wife pioneers and the brothers are never home. One such wife said crying to her husband: what about me? The elder resigned and is now happier than ever. To continue would have cost him marriage and happiness.
To add insult to this trend, congregations are now instructed to cover expenses of aging ones in the hall, so that their sons and daughters can continue serving the society on their assignment instead of coming home to help their parents. (This is a WT from 2014)
The congregation fund is empty, all sent off to Bethel, and nothing is left for the poor.
Jesus preached the good news and helped the poor with his money.
Of course Judas felt this money was better spent on himself.Reply by GodsWordIsTruth on 2014-02-12 10:42:30
Alex your comment is a heartbreaking reality.
As a regular pioneer myself for many years (I am no longer on the list) I made a lot of sacrifices to meet the WTBS’s demands for my time and resources. I have come to realize that my heart was in the right place in serving Jehovah and the people of my community by preaching the good news. However my view (the view pushed by the GB) is unbalanced. I still sit in the hall and fight the tendency to feel guilty with thoughts of …. “I can be doing more in service… I should be doing more service … why aren’t you doing more service?” Someone made a comment on another post that we are really making disciples of the GB and not Christ. In some respects I tend to agree with that comment .
The GB has this huge plan of expanding our religion to every corner of the earth. Our mission and focus is solely evangelizing and building Kingdom Halls. The congregation I grew up in always in the red. So even if we had “extra” money it could not have gone to care of the orphans and widows anyway because we were indebted to the WTBS. If only we could have the spirit of the first century congregation in managing our own funds so that we can make sure funds are designated to charitable works.
The work in Katrina is a testament to Christian unity, sacrifice and God’s holy spirit at work on the volunteers.
Reply by Meleti Vivlon on 2014-02-12 10:43:06
Excellent, scripturally based points, Alex.
Reply by kev on 2014-02-12 12:39:25
Which watchtower is that alex in 2014
Reply by Alex Rover on 2014-02-12 13:28:53
Wt march 15, 2014 "Honor the aged among you"
10 Full-time servants whose theocratic assignments have taken them far from home may face particularly difficult decisions. Those serving as Bethelites, missionaries, and traveling overseers all view their assignment as precious, as a blessing from Jehovah. Still, if their parents get sick, the first reaction might be, ‘We need to leave our assignment and return home to look after our parents.’ Yet, it would be wise to consider prayerfully whether that is what the parents really need or desire. No one should hastily give up service privileges, and it may not always be necessary. Could the health issue be temporary, one with which some in the parents’ congregation would be happy to help?—Prov. 21:5.
11 Consider, for example, the case of two fleshly brothers who served far from home. One was a missionary in South America, the other worked at world headquarters, in Brooklyn, New York. The brothers’ elderly parents needed help. The sons and their wives visited the parents in the Far East to see what help could best be provided and how. In time, the couple in South America were weighing leaving their assignment to return home. Then they received a telephone call from the coordinator of the body of elders in the parents’ congregation. Those elders had discussed the situation and wanted the missionaries to continue in their assignment as long as possible. The elders appreciated this couple’s service and were determined to do all they could to help them care for their parents. All in the family appreciated the loving concern.Reply by kev on 2014-02-12 14:38:29
Just read the article alex and to be fair to the watchtower on the whole i found the article to be quite balanced and scriptural But thats just my opinion
Comment by Alex Rover on 2014-02-13 11:40:23
It is a balanced series of articles, but we were considering the pressure on the congregations in context. What is reality, is that all money goes to the corporation, and the congregations are poor. In this context, the suggestion reads for the poor to help the poor. Nowhere in the articles they talk about how they use the donations to help care for aging full time servants.
Open book society finances may draw criticism, and some people will never be satisfied even then. Perhaps we find out how many millions went to child abuse cases and the like. Are they using Jehovah's money for protecting themselves from consequences of bad policy or to help the poor?
Also, the society invested money in training missionaries and bethelites. Thus the advice to congregations is to help protect this investment. The scriptural responsibility is on the children, not the congregation. And while it's not a bad thing for the congregation to help financially, we need to open our eyes to the reason they wrote those two paragraphs.
Would the same example be written where the two families served instead as mere regular pioneers where the need is greater?
Who works harder?
Part time work, regular pioneers put in 120 hours a month each to sustain themselves financially, while putting in another 70 in the preaching work. That's 380 hours a month for the couple combined. If the brother is an elder, add 30 hours of congregational work, so 410 hours.
Special pioneer couples put in 2*120=240 hours in service. If the brother is elder, add 30 hours of congregational work, 270 hours.
Elders who works full time (160 hours) to support regular pioneer wife (70 hours) and kids, spends 30 hours a month on the congregation and 20 in service. (50) total: 290 hours.
Bethelites and the GB always work, 240 hours of bethel work, 10 hours preaching totals 490 for a couple, and 30 for elder, so 520 hours.
It's clear we are all worthy of support in Levitical work, but the pioneers and elders also support the other two groups financially, and now should also consider supporting financially the parents of those two groups. When they themselves get older, they probably did not save to support their own needs.Reply by miken on 2014-02-13 12:09:52
However, it is clear from a situation that arose in the first century that congregations are interested in caring for the needs of exemplary older brothers and sisters. The Bible says about the Jerusalem congregation that “no one was in need among them.”
Watchtower March 15, 2014, p 23 para 13
It appears only exemplary ones (I didn't notice exemplary in the scriptures) are to receive congregational support. Local elders presumably would decide who is exemplary but on what criteria?Reply by Alex Rover on 2014-02-13 12:13:57
Was everyone in Jerusalem exemplary?
No one was in need....
Helping the poor does not come with qualifications or tests. You see a hungry person, be a Good Samaritan.Reply by In Need of Grace on 2014-02-13 13:25:03
Excellent point. Luke 6:30 ;)
Reply by kev on 2014-02-13 13:22:20
Thanks alex for your explanation and i do agree there may be potential problems in following that counsel .we just cannot shirk our responsibities toward our parents our service could end up like a gift of corban . 1 timothy 5 is absolutely clear on who should shoulder the responsibilty of caring for elderly parents . And i know what you mean about how they place pressure on people i experienced it myself for years as an elder with 3 children and my wife who looked after them and i was the breadwinner we lived on one wage.I was so stressed out .It shouldnt be like that thanks kev
Reply by Meleti Vivlon on 2014-02-13 15:28:18
Hi Alex,
I'm not sure how you get 240 hours of Bethel work. They work 8 - 5 with an hour off for lunch. Most don't work Saturday mornings anymore. So that means they work a 40 hour work week, plus 10 for service making 340 hours plus 30 if he's an elder making 370.Reply by Alex Rover on 2014-02-13 17:59:21
I did 10 hours, 6 days, 4 weeks.
I've overdone it, counting 10 hour days because they wake up so early. I was also considering the overtime working on Saturdays in relation to the new headquarters construction.
Comment by Meleti Vivlon on 2014-02-13 22:28:34
I understand. This is a bit of a pet peeve of mine. I have talked with Bethelites who moan about how busy they are. How hard they work.
So they have to wake up at 7 AM to be ready for the "Morning Worship" which they walk to. Meanwhile, their rooms are cleaned by others, their clothes are washed and ironed by others, their meals are prepared by others and their dishes are washed by others. They don't have to spend time shoveling the driveway, mowing the lawn or buying groceries.
Their real world counterparts also gets up a 7 AM, but they have to prepare their own breakfast then sit in traffic for 30 to 60 minutes in all kinds of weather to get to work by 9. They then work to 5 or later if needed, but for them the overtime is selfish and worldly, and if they miss a meeting it shows a lack of spiritual appreciation, while the Bethelite working overtime is doing the Lord's will and is excused if he has to miss a meeting because of it. (As a matter of fact, if a brother refuses to work overtime at this world job so as to make a meeting, we applaud him, while a Bethelite is not allowed to refuse overtime work just because it would make him miss a meeting.)
Anyway, our brother gets home at 6 or 7 even if he leaves work on time. So he's been going for 12 hours and he or she still has to prepare supper, eat it, then wash the dishes, maybe wash and iron, or go grocery shopping, or mow the lawn or shovel the snow, or do any of the other things that our Bethel brother has taken care of for him as one of the perks of the job.
Our Bethelite leaves work at 5 and walks back to his apartment cleaned apartment. Dumps his dirty laundry in the hamper for someone else to take care of and heats the food he took home from the excess at lunch. He's preparing his meeting or watching TV by 5:30.
The only ones who have it easier than the Bethelites are the C.O.s and D.O.s.
So don't get me started. Too late. You already did.
:)Reply by Alex Rover on 2014-02-13 23:16:20
All you said is true..
Reply by anderestimme on 2014-02-15 19:07:01
And then one of these Pampered Ones writes an article about how we - the ones who pay for the starch on their freshly pressed undies - are showing disrespect for the Most High if we get to the service group late. Or they send out a glossy brochure telling us how to dress at the installations we paid for and that, if we have a blue-collar job, we can just drop our correspondence in the mail slot so as to avoid profaning the lobby. Of course, if we don't like it, we can always take our contributions elsewhere.
Reply by anderestimme on 2014-02-15 19:08:06
I mean, "sacrifices".
Comment by Sargon on 2014-02-16 16:43:11
Did anyone notice that there is a difference in wording between the PDF version of paragraph 16 and the print version? The pdf version removed the sentence about not volunteering on kingdom hall builds if our circumstances don't allow it.
Reply by anderestimme on 2014-02-16 19:32:01
Just checked and that sentence doesn't appear in the print or on-line versions in Spanish.
Reply by Alex Rover on 2014-02-16 20:02:36
It's likely just a meps permitted rendering. I wouldn't seek anything more important behind it.
Reply by anderestimme on 2014-02-18 12:14:37
"Meps permitted rendering"??? Please explain.