“Truly I say to you that this generation will by no means
pass away until all these things happen.” (Mt 24:34)
There are essentially two methods we can use to understand the meaning of Jesus’ words regarding “this generation”. One is called eisegesis, and the other, exegesis. The Governing Body makes use of the first method in this month’s TV broadcast to explain Mt 24:34. We will use the second method in a follow-up article. For now, we should understand that eisegesis is employed when one already has an idea of what a text means. Entering with a preconception, one then works to make the text fit and support the concept. This is by far the most common form of Bible research.
Here’s the scenario the Governing Body is burdened with: They have a doctrine that claims that Jesus began to reign invisibly in the heavens in 1914, a year that also marked the beginning of the last days. Based on this interpretation, and making use of typical/antitypical representations, they have further deduced that Jesus appointed them to be his faithful and discreet slave over all true Christians on earth in the year 1919. Therefore, the authority of the Governing Body and the urgency with which the preaching work must be carried out all hinges on 1914 being what they claim it is.[i]
This creates a serious issue with regard to the meaning of “this generation” as expressed in Matthew 24:34. The people making up the generation that saw the beginning of the last days in 1914 had to be of an age of understanding. We are not talking newborn infants here. Therefore, the generation in question is well past the century mark – 120 years of age and counting.
If we look up “generation” in a dictionary as well as a Bible lexicon, we will find no basis for a generation of such a great length in the modern era.
The September Broadcast on tv.jw.org is the latest attempt by the Governing Body to explain its solution to this apparent conundrum. However, is the explanation valid? More important, is it scriptural?
Brother David Splane does an excellent job of expounding the latest interpretation of Matthew 24:34. I’m sure his words will convince the vast majority of Jehovah’s Witnesses that our current understanding is accurate. The question is, “Is it true?”
I daresay that the majority of us would be fooled by a high-quality counterfeit $20 bill. Counterfeit money is designed to look like, feel like, and totally replace the real thing. Nevertheless, it is not the real thing. It is literally not worth the paper it is printed on. To reveal its worthless nature, store keepers will expose a bill to ultraviolet light. Under this light, the security strip on a US $20 bill will glow green.
Peter warned Christians about those who would exploit them with counterfeit words.
“However, there also came to be false prophets among the people, as there will also be false teachers among you. These will quietly bring in destructive sects, and they will even disown the owner who bought them…they will greedily exploit you with counterfeit words.” (2Pe 2:1, 3)
These counterfeit words, like counterfeit money, can be virtually indistinguishable from the real thing. We must examine them under the right light to reveal their true nature. Like the ancient Beroeans, we examine the words of all men using the unique light of the Scriptures. We strive to be noble-minded, that is, open to new ideas and eager to learn. However, we are not gullible. We may well trust the person handing us the $20 bill, but we still put it under the right light to be sure.
Are David Splane’s words the real thing, or are they counterfeit? Let us see for ourselves.
Analyzing the Broadcast
Brother Splane begins by explaining that “all these things” not only refers to the wars, famines, and earthquakes mentioned in Mt 24:7, but also to the great tribulation spoken of in Mt 24:21.
We could spend time here attempting to show that the wars, famines, and earthquakes were not part of the sign at all.[ii] However, that would take us off topic. So let us concede for the moment that they do form part of “all these things,” because there is a much bigger issue that we might otherwise miss; one which Brother Splane would apparently have us overlook. He would have us infer that the great tribulation Jesus is speaking of is still in our future. However, the context of Mt 24:15-22 can leave no doubt in the mind of the reader that our Lord is referring to the great tribulation that was the siege and destruction of Jerusalem from 66 to 70 C.E. If that is part of “all these things” as David Splane states, then the generation had to have seen it. That would require us to accept a 2,000-year-old generation, not something he wants us to think about, so he just assumes a secondary fulfillment though Jesus made no mention of one, and ignores the very inconvenient actual fulfillment.
We must regard as highly suspect, any explanation of Scripture which requires us to pick and choose which parts apply and which do not; especially when the choice is arbitrarily made without providing any scriptural support for the decision.
Without further ado, Brother Splane next employs a very astute tactic. He asks, “Now, if you are asked by someone to identify a Scripture that tells us what a generation is, what scripture would you turn to?… I’ll give you a moment… Think about that…. My choice is Exodus chapter 1 verse 6.”
This statement together with the manner in which it is delivered would have us infer that the scripture of his choice holds all the information we need to find support for his definition of “a generation”.
Let us see if that turns out to be the case.
“Joseph eventually died, and also all his brothers and all that generation.” (Ex 1:6)
Do you see a definition of “generation” contained in that verse? As you’ll see, this is the only verse David Splane uses in support of his interpretation.
When you read a phrase like “all that generation”, you might naturally wonder what “that” refers to. Fortunately, you do not need to wonder. The context provides the answer.
“Now these are the names of Israel’s sons who came into Egypt with Jacob, each man who came with his household: 2 Reuʹben, Simʹe·on, Leʹvi, and Judah; 3 Isʹsa·char, Zebʹu·lun, and Benjamin; 4 Dan and Naphʹta·li; Gad and Ashʹer. 5 And all those who were born to Jacob were 70 people, but Joseph was already in Egypt. 6 Joseph eventually died, and also all his brothers and all that generation.” (Ex 1:1-6)
As we saw when we looked at the dictionary definition of the word, a generation is, “the entire body of individuals born and living at about the same time” or “a group of individuals belonging to a specific category at the same time”. Here the individuals belong to the same category (the family and household of Jacob) and are all living at the same time. What time? The time when they “came into Egypt”.
Why does Brother Splane not refer us to these clarifying verses? Simply put, because they do not support his definition of the word “generation.” Employing eisegetical thinking, he concentrates only on the one verse. For him, verse 6 stands on its own. There is no need to look elsewhere. The reason is that he does not want us to think about a point in time like the entry into Egypt any more than he wants us to think of another point in time like 1914. Instead, he wants us to concentrate on the lifespan of an individual. To begin with, that individual is Joseph, though he has another individual in mind for our day. To his mind, and apparently the collective mind of the Governing Body, Joseph becomes the generation Exodus 1:6 is referring to. To illustrate, he asks whether a baby born 10 minutes after Joseph died, or person who died 10 minutes before Joseph was born, could be considered part of Joseph’s generation. The answer is no, because neither would be a contemporary of Joseph.
Let us reverse that illustration to show how this is counterfeit reasoning . We will assume that a person – call him, John – died 10 minutes after Joseph was born. That would make him a contemporary of Joseph. Would we then conclude that John was part of the generation that came into Egypt? Let us assume a baby – we’ll will call him Eli – was born 10 minutes before Joseph died. Would Eli also be part of the generation that entered Egypt? Joseph lived for 110 years. If both John and Eli also lived 110 years, we can then say that the generation that entered Egypt measured 330 years in length.
This may seem silly, but we are simply following the logic that brother Splane has provided to us. To quote his exact words: “For the man [John] and the baby [Eli] to be part of Joseph’s generation, they would have had to have lived at least some time during Joseph’s lifespan.”
Considering when I was born, and based on the explanation that David Splane provides, I can safely say that I am part of the generation of the American Civil War. Perhaps I shouldn’t use the word “safely”, for I fear that if I were to actually say such things in public, men in white coats might come to take me away.
Brother Splane next makes a particularly shocking statement. After referring to Matthew 24:32, 33 where Jesus uses the illustration of leaves on trees as a means to discern the coming of summer, he states:
“Only those with spiritual discernment would draw the conclusion, as Jesus said, that he is near the doors. Now here’s the point: Who in 1914 were the only ones who saw the various aspects of the sign and drew the right conclusion? That something invisible was occurring? Only the anointed.”
Drew the right conclusion? Are Brother Splane and the rest of the Governing Body, who have obviously vetted this talk, willfully misleading the congregation? If we are to assume they are not, then we must assume that all of them have no idea that all of the anointed in 1914 believed that Christ’s invisible presence began in 1874 and that Christ was enthroned in the heavens in 1878. We would also have to assume that they have never read The Finished Mystery which was published after 1914 and which stated that the last days, or “the beginning of the time of the end”, began in 1799. The Bible students, those Splane refers to as “the anointed”, believed that the signs Jesus spoke of in Matthew chapter 24 had been fulfilled throughout the 19th century. Wars, famines, earthquakes – it had all already happened by 1914. That was the conclusion they drew. When the war began in 1914, they did not read “the leaves on the trees” and conclude that the last days and Christ’s invisible presence had begun. Rather, what they believed the war signified was the beginning of the great tribulation which would end in Armageddon, the war of the great day of God the Almighty. (When the war ended and peace dragged on, they were forced to rethink their understanding and concluded that Jehovah had cut short the days by ending the war in fulfillment of Mt 24:22, but that soon the second part of the great tribulation would begin, likely around 1925.)
So either we must conclude that the Governing Body is pathetically uninformed about the history of Jehovah’s Witnesses, or that they are in the midst of some group delusion, or that they are willfully lying to us. These are very strong words, I know. I do not use them lightly. If someone can provide us with a real alternative that does not reflect badly on the Governing Body and yet explains this egregious misrepresentation of the facts of history, I will gladly accept it and publish it.
The Fred Franz Overlap
We are next introduced to the person who, like Joseph, represents a generation – specifically, the generation of Mt 24:34. Using the lifespan of Brother Fred Franz, who was baptized in November of 1913 and who passed away in 1992, we are shown how those who were contemporaries of Brother Franz constitute the second half of “this generation”. We are now introduced to the concept of a generation with two halves, or a two-part generation. This is something you will not find in any dictionary nor Bible lexicon. In fact I’m unaware of any source outside of Jehovah’s Witnesses that supports this concept of two overlapping generations constituting a kind of super generation.
However, given David Splane’s example of the man and baby who could constitute part of Joseph’s generation by virtue of overlapping his lifetime, even by a few minutes, we must conclude that what we are looking at in this chart is a three-part generation. For example, C. T. Russell died in 1916, overlapping the period of Franz’s anointing by three full years. He died in his sixties, but there were undoubtedly anointed ones in their 80s and 90s at the time that Fred Franz was baptized. This puts the start of the generation back in the early 1800s, meaning that it is already approaching the 200 year mark. A generation spanning two centuries! That is quite a thing.
Or, we could look at it based on what the word actually means in modern English as well as in both ancient Hebrew and Greek. In 1914, there was a group of individuals of one category (the anointed) who were living at the same time. They made up a generation. We could call them “the generation of 1914”, or “the First World War generation.” They (that generation) have all passed away.
Now let’s look at it by applying Brother Splane’s logic. We often refer to the individuals who lived during the late 60s and early 70s (the period of the American presence in Vietnam) as being the “Hippie generation”. Using the new definition provided to us by the Governing Body, we can also say that they are the “World War I generation.” But it goes farther. There were people in their 90s who saw the end of the Vietnam War. These ones would have been alive in 1880. There were individuals in 1880, who were born at the time Napoleon was waging war in Europe. Therefore, there were people alive in 1972 when the Americans pulled out of Vietnam who were part of the “War of 1812 generation”. This is what we have to accept if we are to accept the Governing Body’s new interpretation of the meaning of “this generation”.
What is the purpose of all this? David Splane explains with these words: “So brothers, we are indeed living deep in the time of the end. Now is no time for any of us to get weary. So let’s all heed Jesus’ counsel, the counsel found that Matthew 24:42, ‘Keep on the watch, therefore, because you do not know on what day your Lord is coming.’”
The fact is Jesus was telling us that we have no way of knowing when he is coming, so we should keep on the watch. Brother Splane, however, is telling us that we do know when he is coming – approximately – he is coming very, very soon. We know this because we can run the numbers to figure out that those few remaining ones of “this generation”, of which the Governing Body is all part, are getting old and will soon die off.
The fact is Brother Splane’s words run contrary to what Jesus tells us just two verses later.
“On this account, you too prove yourselves ready, because the Son of man is coming at an hour that you do not think to be it.” (Mt 24:44)
Jesus is telling us that he will come at a time when we actually think he isn’t coming. This flies in the face of everything the Governing Body would have us believe. They would have us think he is coming within the remaining lifespan of a select few aged individuals. Jesus words are the real deal, true spiritual currency. That means the words of Governing Body are counterfeit.
A Fresh Look at Matthew 24:34
Of course, none of this is satisfying. We still want to know what Jesus meant when he said that this generation would not pass away before all these things occur.
If you have been reading this forum for a some time, you will know that both Apollos and I have attempted several interpretations of Matthew 24:34. I have never really been happy with any of them. They were just too clever. It is not through wise and intellectual reasoning that Scripture is revealed. It is revealed by the holy spirit operating in all Christians. For the spirit to flow freely in all of us and do its work, we must cooperate with it. That means we must remove from our minds such impediments as pride, bias, and preconceptions. The mind and heart must be willing, eager, and humble. I see now that my previous attempts at understanding the meaning of “this generation” were colored by preconceptions and false premises originating from my upbringing as one of Jehovah’s Witnesses. Once I freed myself of those things and took a fresh look at Matthew chapter 24, the meaning of Jesus’ words just seemed to fall into place. I would like to share that research with you in my next article to see what you think of it. Perhaps collectively we can finally put this baby to bed.
[i] For a detailed analysis of whether 1914 has any basis in Scripture, see “1914 – A Litany Of Assumptions“. For a full analysis of the topic on how to identify the faithful and discreet slave of Mt. 25:45-47 see the category: “Identifying the Slave”.
[ii] See “Wars and Reports of Wars – a Red Herring?“
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[…] consider that David Splane in the September Broadcast on tv.jw.org used the members of the Governing Body to exemplify the second group of anointed who […]
Here is the bibles definition of what a generation is:
Exodus 20:5 says: “You must not bow down to them nor be induced to serve them, because I Jehovah your God am a God exacting exclusive devotion, bringing punishment for the error of fathers upon sons, upon the third generation and upon the fourth generation, in the case of those who hate me.”
The topic of the “resurrection of the righteous and the unrighteous” merits some comment. Meleti has suggested in some of his remarks that because there would be a resurrection of the unrighteous, that might include persons who were directly put to death as a result of the express will of God, such as those who died in Noah’s flood. My response was that this creates a problem, because it suggests that God made a mistake in judging a person as worth of death. If they merit a resurrection, why put them to death in the first place? But if they… Read more »
How do you feel about Matthew 10:15? How can it be better for those in Sodom and Gomorrah than for those who do not listen to the apostles if they already died the second death? The wages that sin pays is death. I believe that those who have died, either by Divine judgement or other means, have paid the price. Christ’s ransom can still be applied to those after the resurrection and they will be judged. I do not think it is a logical necessity that being put to death by God and then being resurrected by Him implies any… Read more »
As always, it is important to put the scriptures in context. Here is Matthew 10:11-15: “Into whatever city or village YOU enter, search out who in it is deserving, and stay there until YOU leave. When YOU are entering into the house, greet the household; and if the house is deserving, let the peace YOU wish it come upon it; but if it is not deserving, let the peace from YOU return upon YOU. Wherever anyone does not take YOU in or listen to YOUR words, on going out of that house or that city shake the dust off YOUR… Read more »
I would ask you to take this discussion over to http://www.discussthetruth.com which is set up specifically for this type of dialog. Comments on BP are just that, comments on the article in question. You’ll find the discussion forum more effective for the type of dialog this topic entails.
Try again… Why do we even think ‘this generation’ refers to the anointed, let alone two generations of anointed. The use of the pronoun ‘this’ indicates that Jesus was not referring to the disciples ( or he would have said ‘you’ as he does on several occasions), but to the generation of people contemporaneous with the disciples who would live to see the destruction of Jerusalem. It seems obvious from reading the passage that this is what Jesus was talking about. Do we have to read into this a modern day parallel any more than the surrounding of Jerusalem with… Read more »
Read Zechariah 14
There is to be a final war by the nations against Jerusalem – this is yet to happen, which would mean that Jesus was not talking about the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 CE.
“This”… used with periods of time-related to the present. This is the meaning of the word “this” in this instance. It is used to establish a time. It is not complicated, it is easy (I’m sure) to establish if “this” has been translated accurately from the Greek language. It is not referring to a thing, a place, or some other material matter. It is simply referring to that moment in time; relevant to what Christ is strikingly referring to. Namely: the destruction of Jerusalem in approximately ending in 70CE. Better use of English and it’s history would certainly help clear… Read more »
Read Matt 24:29. Jesus is speaking of a terrible time of distress, relating to Jerusalem, but he says it is to be followed “immediately” by his appearance in glory. According to Jesus words there is no gap between the tribulation, heavenly signs and his second coming. Therefore Jesus was not referring to 70 CE, though this may have been a type, but we cannot know that for an absolute certainty.
If we read Matthew 24 keeping the OT in mind we will achieve an understanding of Matt 24:34.
The OT can be described as a map of the future – in order to understand Jesus’ words, we much study the OT. As JWs we did not study the OT intelligently – this is something we must do now in order to find the Truth as Jesus taught.
Truth is always simple and clear, lies end up being a tangled mess. The bible shows us quite clearly how long a generation is from the human perspective. After all Jehovah had done for the nation of Israel when liberating them from Egypt they still lacked faith. Because of this he determined that this generation would not enter the promised land but the new generation would enter, the ones who no longer knew the land of their parents (Egypt). How long would this generation need to be? Let Jehovah answer this very question for us: “‘“And I will bring in… Read more »
I find your last sentence to be profound. It never would have occurred to me to equate the fear factor of 1914, Armageddon in general, etc. and the hellfire doctrine. Perhaps an even closer analogy is to compare the effect of the hellfire doctrine on Christendom with the threat of disfellowshipping and/or the stigma of being called an apostate. The degree of fear and level of control over masses of people are about this same.
Thanks for this remarkable insight.
I know I must not be the only one who when I first saw this Monday on the broadcast, that I knew he was gonna use Exodus 1:6, I knew it, and I still laughed outloud.
Come on we would never say in ordinary terms the things that mr splane is saying . In my mind it was my grandparents who were the generation that experienced the 2 world war . i wasnt around then . This is just changing the goal posts if you ask me this must be one of those things that has to be believed even if it makes no sense . 2 timothy 3 v 8 and 9
We know that God uses typology in the Bible – perhaps that relates to the destruction of Jerusalem in 70CE, we don’t know. What we do know from Jesus words “this generation will not pass away until all these things occur”, if we read the whole chapter of Matthew 24, is that Jesus was referring to all the events of that chapter, including his arrival in Kingdom power.
Actually, I’ll be publishing an article this weekend that will suggest an alternative.
The Organisation’s date setting and lack of scholarly approach has caused much damage to brothers and sisters. It’s time for intelligent Bible study, of which we are all capable.
Seeing as I was born shortly before Fred Franz died, does that make me of the generation that saw 1914? Or am I being presumptuous ; )
According to the Governing Body, it wouldn’t, unless you were immediately baptized and then received the heavenly calling. Sanderson was 10 when he was baptized, so perhaps if you were born in 1982, you could be of the 1914 generation.
Oh darn… but I would be of the generation that saw the Titanic sink, right?
That would mean armageddon is dated as far as 2052 or even 2062 then no no no no it has to be just around the corner . Haha
When David Splane asserted the anointed of 1914 drew the right conclusion about an invisible event I think what he had in mind is the teaching that October 1914 supposedly marked the end of the gentile times. If so, then according to current Watchtower theology the conclusion those anointed drew was incorrect because what they thought the end of the gentile times was is nearly 180 degrees different from what Watchtower teaches today. In effect, in 1914 the anointed thought “The gentile times = X” but today Watchtower teaches “The gentile times = Y”, and X and Y represent contrasts… Read more »
The question David Splane asks and gives us time to answer is “What verse would you choose? [to give the right context of several terms: “all these things”, “this generation” and without explicit mention: “that day and hour.”] This is with the purpose to understand the answer given by Jesus privately to his Apostles, when Jesus said: (Matthew 24:34) “Truly I say to you that this generation will by no means pass away until all these things happen.” Jesus had just denounced in detail in the temple itself the hypocrisy of the scribes and Pharisees. He concluded by saying: (Matthew… Read more »
Sound reasoning, Rufus. I’ll make use of it in the next article if you don’t mind.
It seems the post 1944 GB mixed “weed” apostate “generation” fits the state of Jerusalem of that day, and it “passed away” by Roman boots. Hence Matthew 24:15 and the Bethel UN NGO marker. Imo the “generation” is the mixed in apostate generation Bethel has cultured since 1976 especially.
It will see the first judgment action of 1 Peter 4:17, imo.
What is special about 1944?
In the context of Splane’s argument we would have to read the text of Exodus 1:6 to mean Joseph’s children are part of “that generation” Joseph is said to belong to. But something tells me the context of Exodus 1:6 does not suggest this.
If Exodus 1:6 does not suggest that Joseph’s children should have been included as part of “that generation” then Splane’s argument is wholly unsupported.
To me they have started digging a hole and now they can’t stop digging it. Reminds me of these words of a song by Bernard Cribbins which kind of sums up the attitude of the GB. There I was, a-digging this hole A hole in the ground, so big and sort of round it was There was I, digging it deep It was flat at at the bottom and the sides were steep When along, comes this bloke in a bowler which he lifted and scratched his head Well we looked down the hole, poor demented soul and he said… Read more »
Brothers. This may seem slightly off topic but I want to express a slight unease that I feel that some may be falling into the same trap as the very ones who you are indeed, rightfully showing up to be false. All the words contained within the Holy Scriptures have sat there for scores of generations. But here, people come along and decide they’re going to declare that their generation is special, different to all the others that have come and gone before them. And, in many ways, that attitude is understandable, many generations have felt that way in the… Read more »
Enjoyed that comment christian , its spot on ive believed the very same thing right from the start, i could never understand this hysteria about the end is nigh concept ,of course i see the reason now .
Hi Christian, thank you for your comment. It is true date fixing and focusing makes us become self centred on our own salvation, it’s like running to the life boat and shouting out to others to get in. Do we feel secure in knowing we have the best seat in the boat, just willing the boat to be cast afloat? As Christians we should project love by not putting ourselves first but others. “Whoever finds his soul will lose it, and whoever loses his soul for my sake will find it.” Matt 10
Totally agree with your comment Christian. Even when I was immersed in the organization, I came to the conclusion that I may die in this system. Depressing? Not at all. I remember the Young People Ask video, where the older man dies in the end. I always said I want to be like him. Die old and satisfied like the other faithful ones in the scriptures. As an elder I always tried to emphasize this kind of thinking. The “generation” thing changed 3 times in my life. I simply did not believe it anymore, and I wanted others to not… Read more »
Right when Mr. Splane said that let’s talk about this generation Jesus was talking about. I said Oh Oh, we are gonna mess they are gonna blow it big time. The day before, I promise I picked up the book from my shelf survival into a new earth, and was reading this whole 1914 generation thing, as we all know this book was made by the organization in 1984, and still believed that the tribulation was coming before all those people of 1914 died, and of course looking at page 27, and there declaration ” Present wicked world to be… Read more »
A Generation is 40 years – not 70, 80 or 100 – nor does it overlap anything. What is a biblical generation? (Ex. 20:5, Num. 14:18, Job 42:16) shows this to be the transition from father to son. Apparently, the average time between a father’s first son and his son’s first son is a generation. How long was that? About 40 years. Given the marriage and family customs in ancient times, this estimate seems reasonable. The length might have occasionally been shorter, but it was not likely to be much longer. If couples were going to start a family, they… Read more »
I concur with you about the 40 year generation average. But one question. You refer to “that generation” in quotes as if referencing a scripture. I’m not aware of any relevant scripture where Jesus uses those words?
That is correct; there is no scriptural reference implied, only a ‘phrase’ I was trying to emphasize; sorry for any confusion. I am drawing a conclusion here. The conclusion is that when Jesus discussed “that day and hour” it represents a different, future generation. Why make this conclusion? Because THAT day and hour – THAT generation – is something Jesus does not know about. Yet, THIS generation, the one that lasted 40 years, from the start of Jesus’ ministry to the destruction of Jerusalem, is one that Jesus clearly DID know about, since he knew there would be encamped armies… Read more »
Thanks for the clarification. There is also another option. Perhaps there is no second generation, but only the first.
That is certainly true enough. However, if there is in fact no second generation, what was the day and hour Jesus knew nothing about? It couldn’t be the generation in the first century, because as noted above, he DID know about it. If it’s neither in the first century, nor a future generation, what time period is left for which Jesus was unaware? I wouldn’t know how to answer that, myself. That is, to eliminate a second, future generation as the meaning for ‘that day and hour’, it has to mean something else. But what else is there for it… Read more »
I believe the discussion about a “second, future generation” is a separate topic. Your views are interesting but not sure if scriptural. However, you mentioned: on what terms and under what conditions would the modern day world be judged by God John 3:16-21 gives the answer: either show faith in the Son and receive eternal life or remain in the state as if Jesus did not come into the world. It is up to our Judge (Jesus) to decide if one deserves eternal life. There are many forces to prevent people to believe in Jesus, like in the first century… Read more »
I understand your point, Menrov. However, when I said “If there is no second generation, on what terms and under what conditions would the modern day world be judged by God” it was not in reference to whether God, through Christ, would know how, or be capable of, judging mankind. The issues are (a) properly and fairly notifying everyone on earth, in clear, unambiguous and easy-to-understand terms, what is expected of them, and (b) giving all persons a reasonable amount of time to absorb that life-altering information and acting on it, without duress or the threat of an immediate deadline… Read more »
(a) The premise of this line of reasoning is that if everyone is not properly and fairly notified in clear, unambiguous terms then God would be acting unrighteously, something we know he cannot do. Yet, he didn’t notify the pre-flood world. He didn’t notify the inhabitants of Sodom and Gomorrah. He didn’t notify the invading armies during the kingship of Hezekiah and Jehoshaphat. The flaw in this premise is the erroneous belief that everyone who is killed at Armageddon dies for all time. However, if they come back in the resurrection of the unrighteous, that premise is null and void.… Read more »
Meleti, you wrote above that you have planned a follow-up article on this subject. I look forward to reading it. I understand why you could have issues with my line of reasoning. The fact is, it is speculation (as I will freely admit), and nothing is gained in a contest of “my speculation is better than your speculation”. We are not inspired, and we may be wrong (and frequently are). We need to exercise great care. I have some difficulty with the rebuttal above. You stated, God “didn’t notify the pre-flood world”. The Bible does not actually whether the pre-flood… Read more »
My article will address all these questions. I appreciate your voicing them, because it helps me to focus on the issues that must be addressed. This weekend, I plan to publish a follow-up to the article on the September broadcast on “This Generation”. Following that, I’ll start a series of articles on Salvation. It is an issue I’ve been wanting to understand for some time, but I had to get all the JW doctrinal cobwebs out of my brain first before I could see more clearly what the Bible is actually telling us.
Meleti, I will give you the smallest of “wiggle room” on this one. Let us agree that the most valuable possession a person has is their life. No one could ever pay a higher price for being a sinner than to die on account of it. Whether that death was a ‘natural’ one, or was hastened by God, the price was still paid. Perhaps death at God’s hands would act as a form of ‘discipline’, so that when (presumably) resurrected later, the person would understand with certainty, and appreciate more fully the depth of their wrongdoing. That certain knowledge might… Read more »
Simply put its all excuses to keep the1914 false teaching a true, but one false teaching creates a lot of other false teachings to keep the original false teaching going.
I doubt if they ever could see the truth they couldn’t change because that would not support the 1919 teaching of the GB appointment and the whole foundation of this religion is 1914 and now 1919.
Hi Anonymous, I agree with a lot of your reasoning, however, as to the grounds on which God is going to determine the eternal future of currently 7 billion people, I beg to differ with your view on scriptural grounds, in that we already know that God is not going to judicially execute even a single person for the aggregate of transgression, no matter how grievous or large, that was committed by them as a result of their inherited sinfulness, but only due to their wilful rejection of God’s remedy for their sin, namely, Christ’s sacrifice, the offer of redemption… Read more »
God is a God of mercy, don’t think he will be destroying starving people that cant comprehend a thing due to malnutrition, or mentally deformed people or children, yes lets leave it at that the judgement of their hearts, the POTENTIAL that God sees.