“Look! a great crowd, which no man was able to number, . . . standing before the throne and before the Lamb.”—Revelation 7:9.
[From ws 9/19 p.26 Study Article 39: November 25 – December 1, 2019]
Before we start this week’s Watchtower study review, let us take a moment to do some reading of the context of the theme scripture and apply exegesis, letting the scriptures explain themselves.
We will start with Revelation 7:1-3 which opens the scene with: “After this I saw four angels standing upon the four corners of the earth, holding tight the four winds of the earth, that no wind might blow upon the earth or upon the sea or upon any tree. 2 And I saw another angel ascending from the sunrising, having a seal of [the] living God; and he cried with a loud voice to the four angels to whom it was granted to harm the earth and the sea, 3 saying: “Do not harm the earth or the sea or the trees, until after we have sealed the slaves of our God in their foreheads.””
What do we learn here?
- The angels have already been given an important task to do, to harm the earth and the sea.
- The angels are commanded not to proceed until the slaves of God [chosen ones] are sealed on their foreheads.
- The sealing in the forehead is a clear choice visible to all.
Revelation 7:4-8 continues “And I heard the number of those who were sealed, a hundred and forty-four thousand, sealed out of every tribe of the sons of Israel:”. Verses 5-8 then give the names of 12 tribes of Israel, and that 12,000 come from each tribe.
The question that is logically raised is: Is the number sealed (144,000) a literal number or a symbolic number?
Symbolic Number not Literal?
Verses 5-8 help us as does Genesis 32:28, Genesis 49:1-33, Joshua 13 – Joshua 21.
Firstly, let us compare the sons of Israel, with the tribes in the Promised Land and then with this passage in Revelation.
| Actual Sons of Israel | Tribes of Israel | Tribes of Revelation |
| Rueben | Rueben | Judah |
| Simeon | Gad | Rueben |
| Levi | Manasseh | Gad |
| Judah | Judah | Asher |
| Zebulun | Ephraim | Naphtali |
| Issachar | Benjamin | Manasseh |
| Dan | Simeon | Simeon |
| Gad | Zebulun | Levi |
| Asher | Issachar | Issachar |
| Naphtali | Asher | Zebulun |
| Joseph | Naphtali | Joseph |
| Benjamin | Dan | Benjamin |
| Levi |
Points to notice:
- Revelation contains Manasseh who was actually a son of Joseph.
- Revelation does not contain Dan who was a son of Jacob / Israel.
- There were 12 tribes of Israel with allocations in the Promised Land.
- The Tribe of Levi was not given a land allocation, but were granted cities (Joshua 13:33).
- In the Promised Land Joseph had two portions through his sons Manasseh and Ephraim.
- Revelation has Joseph as a tribe, does not have Ephraim (Joseph’s son), but still has Manasseh.
Conclusions from this:
Clearly, the twelve tribes in Revelation must have been symbolic as they neither match Jacob's sons nor the tribes given allocations in the Promised Land.
Additionally, the fact that they are not mentioned in any particular order, whether by birth order, (as in Genesis) or by importance order (e.g. Judah with Jesus as a descendant) has to be an indication that the description in Revelation is meant to be different. The Apostle John had to have known the tribes of Israel were 13 in reality.
The Apostle Peter came to realise the following when directed to go to Cornelius, a gentile [non-Jew]. The account tells us: “At this Peter began to speak, and he said: “Now I truly understand that God is not partial, 35 but in every nation the man who fears him and does what is right is acceptable to him” (Acts 10:34-35).
Furthermore, If the tribes are symbolic, why would the amount chosen from each tribe be anything other than symbolic? If the amount from each tribe is symbolic as is the case, then how can the total of all the tribes of 144,000 be anything more than symbolic?
Conclusion: 144,000 has to be a symbolic number.
Little flock and Other Sheep
The rest of Acts and Apostle Paul’s letters all record how both Gentiles and Jews became Christians and chosen ones together. Also, it records the trials and problems as two very different groups became one flock under Christ, with the Jews very much in the minority as the little flock. The overwhelming evidence from this is that any twelve tribes of Israel in Revelation could not be literal. Why? Because if the twelve tribes were literal tribes of Israel it would exclude the Gentile Christians. Yet Jesus had clearly shown to Peter that the Gentiles were equally acceptable to him, confirming that fact by baptizing Cornelius and his family in holy spirit before they were baptized in water. Indeed, much of the New Testament/Christian Greek letters and record of Acts are the adjusting of the thinking of both Jews and Gentiles to serve together unitedly as one group, one flock under one shepherd. In this action recorded in Acts 10 Jesus did exactly what he promised in John 10:16. Jesus brought in other sheep [Gentiles] who were not of this fold [Christian Jews] and they listened to his voice, becoming one flock, under one shepherd.
Since this great crowd is drawn from all the nations and tribes, we can conclude that it refers to gentile Christians. We can get lost in interpretations, so let us not state anything categorically. However, one possibility is that the 144,000, being a number that is a multiple of 12 (12 x 12,000) indicates a divinely constituted and balanced administration. The number is representative of all christians making up the Israel of God (Galatians 6:16). The number of Jews making up the administration is small—a little flock. However, the number of gentiles is great, hence the reference to a "great crowd that no man can number". Other interpretations are possible, but the takeaway from this is that the JW doctrine that the great crowd standing in the holy of holies, the sanctuary (Greek naos), cannot correspond to a non-existent group of non-anointed Christian friends of God who have no place standing in the temple before the throne of God. Why can we say that? Because they are still sinners and will not have their sin removed until the end of the thousand years. Therefore, they are not justified by God's grace, not declared righteous, and as such cannot stand in the holy of holies as depicted in this vision.
Conclusion: The little flock are the Jewish Christians. The other sheep are the gentile Christians. All share with Christ in the Kingdom of the heavens. Christ united them into one flock under one shepherd starting from the conversion of Cornelius in 36 AD. The Great Crowd of Revelation does not describe a group of non-anointed Christians who are not God's children as Jehovah's Witnesses teach.
Before we move on to examine Revelation 7:9 we need to note at least one more point. Revelation 7:1-3 does not mention where the slaves of God are. Neither does verses 4-8. Indeed, verse 4 categorically states “And I heard the number of those who were sealed”.
Having heard the number of the chosen ones, what would John want to see? Would it not be to see who those chosen ones were?
What would logically be the next event? If you are told the earth and sea will not be harmed until all are sealed, then you are told the large symbolic number of those to be sealed, you would surely want to see those sealed, the reason for the holdup in God’s judgement.
Hence, in Revelation 7:9 Jesus ends the suspense as John records being shown these sealed ones. As to the symbolic number, that is also reaffirmed when John writes “After this I saw, and look! a great crowd, which no man was able to number”. Therefore, according to the context the symbolic number is confirmed to be a great crowd, so great it cannot be numbered. Ergo, it cannot be a literal number.
Significance of White Robes
Notice another common description. Just as the chosen ones are taken from all the symbolic tribes of Israel, so the great crowd is taken “out of all nations and tribes and peoples and tongues” (Revelation 7:9).
Surely at this wonderful revelation John could have echoed the words of the Queen of Sheba to Solomon “But I did not put faith in the reports [I had heard] until I had come and had seen it with my own eyes. And look! I had not been told the half of your great wisdom. You have far surpassed the report that I heard” (2 Chronicles 9:6).
This great crowd is also “standing before the throne and before the Lamb, dressed in white robes; and there were palm branches in their hands” (Revelation 7:9).
Just a few verses earlier John saw these same ones dressed in white robes. Revelation 6:9-11 reads “I saw underneath the altar the souls of those slaughtered because of the word of God and because of the witness they had given. 10 They shouted with a loud voice, saying: “Until when, Sovereign Lord, holy and true, are you refraining from judging and avenging our blood on those who dwell on the earth?” 11 And a white robe was given to each of them, and they were told to rest a little while longer, until the number was filled of their fellow slaves and their brothers who were about to be killed as they had been.”
You will be able to note that the harming of the earth is being held back. Why? Until the [symbolic] number of their fellow slaves was filled. Further, they were issued with a white robe each. That is how the great crowd of chosen ones [slaves] obtained the white robes. Therefore, clearly this portion of scripture in Revelation 6 is followed by the events in Revelation 7. In turn the events in Revelation 7 are related to the earlier events in Revelation 6.
To emphasise their identity Revelation 7:13 continues “In response one of the elders said to me: “These who are dressed in the white robes, who are they and where did they come from?”. As the Apostle John humbly says to the elder that the elder knows better than him, the elder confirms the answer saying “These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and they have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb” (Revelation 7:14). It cannot be a coincidence that the white robes are mentioned frequently as an identifying mark of the chosen ones. Additionally, accepting the robe from Christ, washing their robes in Christs blood indicates these are the ones who have put their faith in Christ's ransom.
The final chapter of Revelation (22), continues this link. Referring to his [Jesus] slaves sealed in the forehead (with Jesus name) (Revelation 22:3-4, Revelation 7:3), Jesus says in Revelation 22:14, “Happy are those who wash their robes, so that they may have authority to go to the trees of life”, referring to those who wash their robes in his blood, by having faith in the ransom value of his sacrifice. (Revelation 7:14)
Article Review
With the context of the theme scripture clear in mind we can now examine and easily identify the speculations that follow in the Watchtower article.
It starts early on in Paragraph 2:
“The angels are told to hold back the destructive winds of the great tribulation until the final sealing of a group of slaves. (Rev. 7:1-3) That group is made up of 144,000 who will rule with Jesus in heaven. (Luke 12:32; Rev. 7:4)”.
No, it is not 144,000 as a literal number, nor is it in heaven. It is based on speculation, not facts.
“Then John mentions another group, so vast that he exclaims: “Look!”—an expression that may indicate his surprise at seeing something unexpected. What does John see? “A great crowd”.
No, it is not another group, it is the same group. Again, based on speculation.
Why would Jesus suddenly change the subject during this revelation? Rather the surprise is because it is such a great crowd rather than limited to a literal 144,000. (Please see scriptural examination of Revelation 7 above in this review).
“In this article, we will learn how Jehovah revealed the identity of that great crowd to his people more than eight decades ago”. (Paragraph 3).
No, we will not be able to learn how Jehovah revealed the identity of the great crowd, because in the article there is neither claim nor evidence of the mechanism that he used. Rather we will learn of changing speculation by the Organization.
Evolution of men’s reasoning, not revelation from God, or Jesus
Paragraphs 4 to 14 deal with within the Organization, the evolution of men’s reasoning on the understanding of this teaching of the Organization. However, of Jehovah’s involvement and how Jehovah revealed or transmitted the current teaching there is not even a hint, let alone a viable provable explanation.
Par.4 – “They understood that God would restore Paradise on earth and that millions of obedient humans would live here on earth—not in heaven. However, it took time for them to discern clearly who these obedient humans would be”.
No divine revelation or divine transmission here!
Par.5 – “Bible Students also discerned from the Scriptures that some would be “bought from the earth”.
No divine revelation or divine transmission here!
Par. 6 - Citing Revelation 7:9 “Those words led the Bible Students to conclude”.
No divine revelation or divine transmission here!
Par. 8 – “the Bible Students felt that there were three groups”.
No divine revelation or divine transmission here!
Par. 9. – “In 1935 the identity of the great crowd in John’s vision was clarified. Jehovah’s Witnesses came to realize that the great crowd…. “.
No divine revelation or transmission here!
Paragraph 9 to be fair is accurate in nearly everything it states, except for the last sentence, which claims “Only one group is promised everlasting life in heaven—the 144,000, who will “rule as kings over the earth” with Jesus. (Revelation 5:10)”. Yet, the reality is there is only one group and the hope for all is to live on earth. Indeed, the scripture cited in support of this statement to imply a location in heaven is a subtle mistranslation. The Kingdom Interlinear, a Watchtower Bible Translation, instead reads “they are reigning [ἐπὶ] upon the earth”. If you read the extensive definitions of “epi” in different uses you will not find one place where it can be taken to mean “over” as in “above” location wise, especially when associated with the word “reigning” which is to exert power over, not to be in a different physical location.
Par.12 – “Furthermore, the Scriptures teach that those who are resurrected to heavenly life receive “something better” than do the faithful men of old. (Hebrews 11:40)”.
No, they do not. Quoting in full Hebrews 11:39-30 says “And yet all of these, although they received a favorable witness because of their faith, did not obtain the fulfillment of the promise, 40 because God had foreseen something better for us, so that they might not be made perfect apart from us”.
Here Paul states that the faithful men of old did not get the fulfillment of their promise. The reason why, was because he had something better in store for them, which could be realised once Jesus proved faithful to death. Furthermore, these faithful men of old would be made perfect with the faithful Christians, not at a separate time, not in a separate place, not apart, but together. Given that these faithful ones had a hope to be resurrected back to earth as perfect humans, it stands to reason that the faithful Christians would have this same reward.
Yet, the Organization in total contradiction to this scripture teaches exactly the opposite. How so? In that according to the Organization, those claiming to be faithful anointed christians who have died have already had a resurrection to heaven, apart from the faithful ones, like Abraham, God’s friend, who still lie in the memorial tombs.
The Beroean Study Bible reads “God had planned something better for us, so that together with us they would be made perfect.”.
Clearly, no divine revelation or divine transmission. Why would God choose to reverse the clear statement in this scripture against what it says!
A rare admission
Before moving on, we must highlight a seemingly insignificant statement at the beginning of paragraph 4. “Christendom generally does not teach the Scriptural truth that one day obedient humans will live forever on earth. (2 Cor. 4:3, 4)”.
Note the word “generally”. This is an accurate statement, but a rare and significant admission by the Organization. When the reviewer was researching what Mankind's true hope for the future is, he was aware of only one group that taught differently. He only knew this from speaking to a member of the group in the door-to-door ministry, not from the Organization. On the completion of the research about Mankinds true hope for the future, he searched for similar beliefs among other Christian groups on the internet and found a number had come to similar conclusions. It was very interesting that an unbiased genuine search for the truth on this matter had resulted in very similar conclusions.
A Diverse great crowd
Yet more organization-centric interpretation, as if no other religious organization publishes literature in other languages and no other religious organization has members from all races and tongues.
The Bible Society, for instance, has distributing the Bible as its main aim, as opposed to a sectarian publication like The Watchtower. It makes available translations of the Bible in hundreds of languages. Also, interestingly, it publishes annual accounts on its website for all to see; what they receive and what they do with the money. (The Organization could take a hint from this about openness and honesty.) Further they make no claim to be God’s organization, they just aim to get the Bible into people’s hands as they are confident the Bible will make a difference to their lives. This is just one commendable example and there are no doubt many others.
In conclusion
Answers to The Watchtower article review questions:
What misconceptions about the great crowd were corrected in 1935?
The answer is: None, the Organization still has many misconceptions about the great crowd as clearly proven in this review.
How has the great crowd proved to be truly great in size?
The answer is: The “great crowd” as defined by the Organization is not truly great in size. Furthermore, there is much anecdotal evidence that the Organization is shrinking at present and that they are trying to disguise that fact. In reality the real great crowd is all the Christians, both Jew and Gentile, over the centuries who have lived as true Christians (not nominal Christians).
What evidence do we have that Jehovah is gathering a diversified great crowd?
The answer is: No evidence is provided that Jehovah is backing the Organization of Jehovah’s Witnesses.
Rather, the fact that there are millions of genuine Christians around the world scattered amongst the Christian religions as wheat amongst the weeds is the evidence of Jehovah gathering those right hearted ones to him. Matthew 13:24-30, John 6:44.
Archived Comments
We have moved to the Disqus commenting system. To post a new comment, go to the bottom of this page.
Comment by leaving_quietly on 2019-11-24 13:30:33
This may interest you, Tadua.
The tribes list in Revelation does match a listing of tribes by the second year of coming out of Egypt, with the exception of Dan. (Num 1:1) Not in order, but as far as who is listed. It appears Levi replaces Dan in the list in Revelation. There is a noted exception in Numbers 1 regarding Levi.
Out of the tribe of Judah 12,000 sealed; - Num 1:26
out of the tribe of Reuʹben 12,000; - Num 1:20
out of the tribe of Gad 12,000; - Num 1:24
out of the tribe of Ashʹer 12,000; - Num 1:40
out of the tribe of Naphʹta·li 12,000; - Num 1:42
out of the tribe of Ma·nasʹseh 12,000; - Num 1:34
out of the tribe of Simʹe·on 12,000; - Num 1:22
out of the tribe of Leʹvi 12,000; - Num 1:47 (NOTE: there was a special handling of the Levites)
out of the tribe of Isʹsa·char 12,000; - Num 1:28
out of the tribe of Zebʹu·lun 12,000; - Num 1:30
out of the tribe of Joseph 12,000; - Num 1:32 (Joseph through Ephraim)
out of the tribe of Benjamin 12,000 sealed. - Num 1:36
Dan is mentioned in Numbers (Num 1:38)
1 Chronicles 2:1,2 lists the sons of Israel. Manasseh is not mentioned because Manasseh was not a direct son of Israel. Neither was Ephraim. Manasseh and Ephraim were Joseph's sons. Both had their lineage listed in Numbers, but Joseph was the paternal head listed with it being noted as "through Ephraim). At some point, Ephraim lost God's favor. (Isa 7:8) That could be why it's not listed in Revelation, either.
Why Dan is not listed in Revelation is something I do not know. Perhaps Levi replaced Dan. But at least we can find the Revelation listing elsewhere in the Bible.
Comment by Chet on 2019-11-24 15:25:45
This is quite interesting and very neatly dovetails with what I have learned since no longer actively participating in the JW organization.
The idea of “going to heaven” is based, mostly, on Greek notions. If God we’re to take 144,000 from the earth and give them eternal life as heavenly creatures, then there would be a permanent change in the order of things as a side effect of Satan’s rebellion. There would be people bereft of relatives because they had been called to heaven. Even when I was an active and zealous participant in the Witness activities, this always bothered me.
The Witnesses began teaching the earthly hope in the ‘30s and this appealed to a lot of people. It appealed to me and, I guess, this made it easy to convince people that the Watchtower had been given a special revelation in this regard. However, the Witnesses are in no way unique in believing in an earthly hope. I have personally heard the earthly hope explained by Mormons, and any number of Christians, especially the non-denominational Christians whom are growing in numbers. Over the last 15 years, I’ve asked any number of Christians about the earthly hope and found that most of them believed in an earthly hope of one sort of another.
Perhaps the most compelling explanation I have ever heard is that when Christ returns, the Kingdom will be established from the site of the former Temple and that Christ will rule from there. The Christians reigning along with Christ will serve as earthly representatives of the Kingdom and the authority of this Kingdom will be directly from God.
So, which makes more sense; that 144,000 people will reign invisibly from heaven or that the Kingdom will be a literal, visible, tangible administration, here on the earth? To me, there is no question to which I would prefer.
This also addresses another question that bothered me for years, and that is how the Kingdom would communicate with its earthly subjects. Remember, all authority has been granted to Christ. He has no need to check in with Jehovah when it comes to leading earth’s affairs. Christians seen fit to serve in that government will have a role and, perhaps, could serve as local representatives of the Kingdom government. I don’t want to speculate regarding the details, but it makes a lot of sense to me that there will be some earthly manifestation of this government and not just “transmissions” from heaven.
I find it ironic that the number of JWs partaking at Memorial seems to keep increasing. From the perspective of a few decades back, this seems totally illogical. It doesn’t mesh with their beliefs. I wonder if among the rank and file Witnesses, there are more and more people coming to reject the notion of two classes of Christians and arriving at the conclusion that they need to partake of communion, just as commanded.
Comment by frankvague on 2019-11-24 23:38:50
Thanks for the article!
An interesting aspect of Revelation seems to be that sometimes two different consecutive symbols are used to speak of the same thing. A good example of this is Rev 5:5, 6 where the one who opens the scrolls is first referred to as a lion and then as a lamb. From the context it is obvious both of the symbols refer to the same person. The language resembles Re 7:9 to an extent that it seems reasonable to apply this logic to 144k/Great Crowd as well.
Comment by Leonardo Josephus on 2019-11-26 09:09:39
Tadua, your articles are getting better and better. I think you are spot on in connecting the 144000 as being very much linked with the Great Crowd, and there are plenty of other sites which reach the same conclusion. Jews and Gentiles make one flock.
However, you do not seem to have commented in what way the Great Crowd come out of the Great Tribulation. I would appreciate your thoughts on that.
Thank you.Reply by swaffi on 2019-11-27 21:58:22
Hi Leonardo, nice to be of acquaintance. I have to be honest and say that I still don't know whether the bible tells about a future great tribulation or not. Matthew 24:21 Jesus tells me that it already happened at Jerusalem's destruction and that it would never happen again. I've tried to have this discussion with JW elders when I was in the org but never got a satisfying answer. Of course, this may have a bearing on Revelation 7:14 (if in fact, Jesus is talking about the same great tribulation) I'd be happy to hear your thoughts on this. Regards, Grant
Reply by Leonardo Josephus on 2019-11-29 04:52:52
Hi Grant,
Thanks for your comments. I am no expert, but hear are my thoughts :-
I was nor around in the first century, and there is plenty I do not understand. However, Jesus words in Matthew 24 about the generation I can understand, and he refers to his generation not passing away. That to me is reasonably conclusive. I do not think I need to join all the rest of the dots up, and explain things in Matthew 24 that I just do not feel equipped to do. It would have been nice if Jesus had put things more clearly, but he didn't. And he often did not put things clearly, or at least they were not put clearly in the gospels, so i must settle on that being the case.
Revelation 7 was written after 70 CE, as John wrote after that date, as far as we know. Thus those events must be for the future, and they have not happened yet. If they are not in the future, then we need not bother with the book of Revelation or John was just writing stuff down as he saw in vision, and then we really will be guessing. The confusing part to me is Jesus telling him to write down things that will shortly take place.
All I know is that being told that the GT is round the corner is not much different from the fear of hell fire, with the added effect of wasting large parts of my life, by not using our talents etc, as well as wrecking relationships. We come to know the scriptures, which is good, but then misapply some very badly.
There are many times when I think that all I would like is to be a good Christian and be left to discuss these scriptural things freely, and just do what I can to imitate Jesus Christ in my life. Maybe that is all God wants of me.
Of course, as no man knows the day or the hour, then neither do I.
Hope this helps
LJReply by swaffi on 2019-11-29 19:15:44
Very well said, Leonardo. I appreciate your thoughts and comments. Yep, just trying our best to follow the Christ is the way to go
Grant
Comment by Leonardo Josephus on 2019-11-30 04:35:02
May I add to my earlier comment, and this is only a point picked up from the michaeljfleker You Tube video on the same subject, which you have touched on, that Revelation 7 says "do not harm the earth etc until we have sealed the slaves of our God". As the Great Crowd are clearly through unharmed, surely therefore they must also be "slaves".
Comment by Astoriaboy on 2019-12-01 14:19:03
Something else to keep in mind. It was one man who came up with this unscriptural interpretation. Joseph Rutherford. He was the only person who wrote the books and articles the witnesses studied from 1919 until his death in 1942. There was no Governing Body nor any fabricated "faithful and discreet slave. A private interpretation of his, used to hold and maintain power over gullible followers.
Comment by Astoriaboy on 2019-12-01 14:25:58
Something else I noticed about the 144,000. They are taken or subcontracted from a greater number. "Out of the tribe of Judah 12,000." What is that greater number from which they're taken, and who are they? We are not told.
Comment by “The Spirit Itself Bears Witness” - Beroean Pickets - JW.org Reviewer on 2020-03-22 11:35:50
[…] an in-depth examination on the great crowd and little flock, see here. For an in-depth examination on what is Mankind’s hope for the future? see […]
Comment by The Great Crowd of Other Sheep Praise God and Christ - Beroean Pickets - JW.org Reviewer on 2021-03-14 11:30:28
[…] https://beroeans.net/2019/11/24/look-a-great-crowd/ […]
Comment by The Great Crowd of Other Sheep Praise God and Christ - Awaken JW's on 2021-03-19 13:59:42
[…] “Look! A Great Crowd” Mankind’s hope for the future. Where will it be? – A Scriptural Examination – Part 6 “The Spirit Itself Bears Witness” […]
Comment by The Great Crowd of Other Sheep Praise God and Christ - Study 3/21 - Awaken JW's on 2021-03-22 12:57:44
[…] “Look! A Great Crowd” Mankind’s hope for the future. Where will it be? – A Scriptural Examination – Part 6 “The Spirit Itself Bears Witness” […]
Comment by “The Spirit Itself Bears Witness” - Study 2020/04 - Awaken JW's on 2022-07-20 01:55:46
[…] an in-depth examination on the great crowd and little flock, see here. For an in-depth examination on what is Mankind’s hope for the future? see […]
Comment by AnnaNana on 2022-11-02 22:35:53
Is the number 144,000 symbolic or literal? Well, where do they come out of? Israel.
"Israel" = Contenders With God
Who are some in the Bible called "Israel"?
Jacob is called Israel. (Literally)
Jacob's physical offspring is called the nation of Israel. (Literally)
Christians are called Israel. (Symbolically)
"...and sit on thrones to judge the 12 tribes of Israel." (Luke 22:30) (Jesus was talking about Christians as symbolically being the 12 tribes of Israel.)
"...to the 12 tribes that are scattered about: Greetings!" (James 1:1) (James was talking to Christians.)
"This is the territory that you will assign as the land inheritance to the 12 tribes of Israel..." (Ezekiel 47:13) (This Ezekiel's temple vision is about the future; the 12 tribes of Israel are Christians symbolically.)
The 12 tribes listed in Revelation are symbolic. They symbolize all Christians. Ezekiel shows that Christians have the hope of a land inheritance here on earth. Jehovah will be here too, because the city on earth is called "Jehovah Is There." (Ezekiel 48:35) Revelation 21:2 says the holy city comes down out of heaven to the earth. Revelation 21:3 says the tent of God is with mankind on earth and he will reside with them on earth. God himself will be with them on earth. You don't have to go to heaven to be with Jehovah. He Causes to Become. He's coming here once everybody's perfect. Nobody will burn up when He comes. He can make a way to not show all his glory at once. He's Jehovah.
Jehovah will wipe every tear out of the eyes of those on earth, Jehovah himself.
"And a spirit proceeded to raise me up and bring me into the inner courtyard, and, look! the House had become full of the glory of Jehovah. And I began to hear someone speaking to me out of the House, and [the] man himself had come to be standing beside me. And He went on to say to me:“Son of man, [this is] the place of my throne and the place of the soles of my feet, where I shall reside in the midst of the sons of Israel to time indefinite..." (Ezekiel 43:5-7)
Jehovah was the one speaking to Ezekiel out of the house. The Man Himself. (Isn't it interesting Jesus is so often called the Son of Man? Who is man's Father again? Man is a chip off the ol' block.) Jehovah told Ezekiel "I shall reside in the midst of the sons of Israel." Jehovah is Our Father. Some of his kids live in heaven. Some live on earth. Jehovah can hang out with both. Angels can visit the earth, why not Jehovah? He made the angels. Jesus did both. Is anything impossible for God?
"As regards the heavens, to Jehovah the heavens belong, but the earth he has given to the sons of men." Jehovah lives in heaven, but He built the earth for his human kids. What Father builds a house for his kids and doesn't go visit them there? Jehovah's hands built Adam. Can't you picture Jehovah down here on earth with his hands forming the body? Jehovah breathed life into Adam's nostrils. Can you picture Jehovah looking into Adam's eyes when they first opened? Adam was built like His Father, and like his brother, Jesus. "Let us make man in our image."
"The One who built the ear, can He not hear? The One who built the eye, can He not see?" The One who built the earth, can He not walk on it? "Later they heard the voice of Jehovah God walking in the garden..." (Jehovah was walking in the garden.) "They hid from the face of Jehovah." (You don't hide from a voice.) They saw his face.
Jehovah has had to endure being physically apart from his beloved human children for thousands of years. It is not fair for Jehovah. The "firstborn from the dead", some of the older kids who are made perfect earlier, the ones made into a new creation, will sacrifice the opportunity to procreate and have different gifts in order to join Jehovah a little earlier than the rest of humans, but it's not because they're extra special. Jehovah chose the lowliest of the low to be anointed, the ones looked down upon, so that the rest would see it's not by works. Why do you think everybody gets so irritated with the governing body? It's not because they're special. It's because they're low. How many of the ancient Israelite kings messed up big time? Most of them. And yet, most of them are awaiting a resurrection. It's the same with all the anointed. Most mess up big. But the ransom is big. That's Jehovah's way, so that no flesh may boast. The lowliness of the anointed serves to exalt the unfathomable riches of Christ's blood.
144,000 is a literal number, a representative sample of some lowly people who made a lot of mistakes who can relate well enough to the rest of humankind so as to fill up the experience of the Christ as regards suffering. Not all in Israel were priests, there was just a representative sample; most Israelites could enjoy their land and home as Jehovah intended. The priests had to go slaughter animals and pour out blood and clean up the mess. (Why envy them?) As one complete unit, the Kingdom government, with Christ and the 144,000, like a man and woman who become one flesh, have suffered while on earth in every way imaginable and so can relate to and love and conduct the necessary priestly household activity in a loving and compassionate manner. They sacrifice the normal wonderful human experience of marriage and childbearing to instead be married in a different way and inherit children on earth. Those on earth inherit them as "parents" - a government (actually, family) of people who will love them as parents love their own children, because Jesus is the Eternal Father, he takes Adam's place. Jesus will walk on the earth with his children. "I will be with you in Paradise." Jesus was talking about eating and drinking and hanging out.
When the anointed go to heaven now Jehovah doesn't have to wait to the end of the 1,000 year reign to embrace some of his human kids. Jehovah is on the figurative torture stake because He can't embrace you right now. It's torture for him. Jesus learned how to endure torture by watching Jehovah. Jehovah wants to be with you physically now, but He is putting himself through this pain because He has something beautiful in store for you and He's willing to wait for it. Israel (Jacob) wrestled all night with an angel so as to get the blessing for his family. His limp after that wrestling was with him all the rest of his life, that pain, until the Paradise. Jehovah is doing the same, enduring the pain, so as to have the blessing for you and with you. You are enduring too, with Jehovah. You are Contending With God, along with Jehovah, in that pain, but you will get the blessing. You are part of Israel.
In the family, there is a firstborn. They didn't do anything special to be firstborn. They were just born first. It's not a big deal. Joseph was not the firstborn. Judah wasn't the firstborn. But all the 12 tribes, all the 12 sons of Israel, got the inheritance, even though some of them made big time mistakes. Judah got the "right" as firstborn because at the time somebody had to take the lead in caring for the family. But we know who Israel favored, it was Joseph. Jehovah isn't saying "I love the anointed more" when someone is anointed. He's just saying, "hey, these guys are born first so they are going to have their abode and assignment over here to take care of some business for the family." They are just a representative sample. It's not a big deal.
Which tribe are you like? Have you had your share of trials, like Joseph? Jehovah was with Joseph. Levi was a murderer, and that's the tribe Jehovah chose to be the priests. What does that tell you about who Jehovah chooses to be anointed? It's so that no flesh may boast.
Jesus is your new father who replaced Adam. Jehovah brought Jesus to heaven to get some stuff done. Would Jehovah bring your new father there if he wasn't coming back? What good father takes off forever? He said he was coming back. Lots of people saw Jesus after he became a new creation, for 40 days after his resurrection. Every eye will see him again soon on earth. Literally. Then, after the new parents (Jesus and the 144,000 who replace Adam and Eve) help the kids get to perfection, at the end of the 1,000 years, the "crowns" will be thrown down and God will become all things to everyone. Our Father. We are a real universal family. A family hangs out and visits each other, but the members have their own "abodes".
Jehovah is coming. He wants his whole family. All his precious ones. He is telling you these things because He loves you. "Lift up your heads, you gates; Open up, you ancient doorways, That the glorious King may enter! Who is he, this glorious King? Jehovah of armies—he is the glorious King."
Comment by inchrist on 2022-11-18 17:31:02
Hi Eric,
Is the 144.000 equal to the little flock or the great crowd? Or the one flock?
Furthermore, in rev 7:14 it speaks of a great crowd coming out of the tribulation. It is my understanding that these are taken to heaven before armageddon?