Since my recent video inviting all baptized Christians to share the Lord’s evening meal with us, there has been a lot of activity in the comment sections of the English and Spanish YouTube channels questioning the whole issue of baptism. For many, the question is whether their former baptism as a Catholic or a Jehovah’s Witness is valid; and if not, how to go about being rebaptized. For others, the question of baptism seems incidental, with some claiming that only faith in Jesus is needed. I wish to address all these views and concerns in this video. My understanding from Scripture is that baptism is a solemn and vital requirement for Christianity.
Let me explain it with a little illustration about driving in Canada.
I’m turning 72 this year. I started driving when I was 16 years old. I have put over 100,000 km on my current car. So that means I’ve easily driven more than a million kilometers in my life. A lot more. I try to obey all the rules of the road. I think I’m a pretty good driver, but the fact that I have all this experience and obey all the traffic laws does not mean that the government of Canada recognizes me as a legal driver. For that to be the case, I must meet two requirements: the first is to carry a valid driver’s license and the other is an insurance policy.
If I’m stopped by the police and cannot produce both of these certificates – a driver’s license and proof of insurance – it doesn’t matter how long I’ve been driving and how good a driver I am, I’m still going to get in trouble with the law.
Similarly, there are two requirements Jesus established for every Christian to meet. The first is to be baptized in his name. At the first mass baptism following the outpouring of the holy spirit, we have Peter telling the crowd:
“. . .Repent, and let each one of YOU be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ . . .” (Acts 2:38)
“. . .But when they believed Philip, who was declaring the good news of the kingdom of God and of the name of Jesus Christ, they proceeded to be baptized, both men and women.” (Acts 8:12)
“. . .With that he commanded them to be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ.. . .” (Acts 10:48)
“. . .On hearing this, they got baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.” (Acts 19:5)
There are more, but you get the point. If you’re wondering why they didn’t baptize in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit as Matthew 28:19 reads, there is a strong body of evidence that indicates that verse was added by a scribe in the 3rd century to bolster belief in the Trinity, since no manuscript from before that time contains it.
For a more thorough explanation of this, please check out this video.
Besides baptism, the other requirement of all Christians established by Jesus was to share in the bread and wine which are symbolic of his flesh and blood given in our behalf. Yes, you have to live a Christian life and you have to put faith in Jesus Christ. Just as you have to obey the rules of the road when you drive. But putting faith in Jesus and following his example won’t enable you to please God if you refuse to obey His Son’s commands to meet these two requirements.
Genesis 3:15 speaks prophetically about the seed of the woman which will eventually crush the seed of the serpent. It is the seed of the woman that puts an end to Satan. We can see that the culmination of the woman’s seed ends with Jesus Christ and includes the children of God that rule with him in the kingdom of God. Therefore, anything Satan can do to impede the gathering of this seed, the gathering of the children of God, he will do. If he can find a way to corrupt and invalidate the two requirements that identify Christians, that give them legitimacy before God, then he will delight in doing so. Sadly, Satan has had enormous success by using organized religion to pervert these two simple, but necessary, requirements.
There are many who are joining us this year for the memorial because they want to partake in accordance with the Bible’s direction on observing the Lord’s evening meal. However, a number are concerned because they are uncertain as to whether their baptism is valid. There have been many comments on both the English and Spanish YouTube channels as well as numerous emails that I get daily that show me just how widespread this concern is. Given how successful Satan has been in clouding the issue, we need to clear away the uncertainty that these various religious teachings have created in the minds of sincere individuals wanting to serve our Lord.
Let us start with the basics. Jesus did not just tell us what to do. He showed us what to do. He always leads by example.
“Then Jesus came from Galilee to the Jordan to John, in order to be baptized by him. But the latter tried to prevent him, saying: “I am the one who needs to be baptized by you, and are you coming to me?” Jesus replied to him: “Let it be this time, for in that way it is suitable for us to carry out all that is righteous.” Then he quit preventing him. After being baptized, Jesus immediately came up from the water; and look! the heavens were opened up, and he saw God’s spirit descending like a dove and coming upon him. Look! Also, a voice from the heavens said: “This is my Son, the beloved, whom I have approved.”” (Matthew 3:13-17 NWT)
We can learn a great deal about baptism from this. John objected at first because he baptized people in symbol of their repentance of sin, and Jesus had no sin. But Jesus had something else in mind. He was instituting something new. Many translations render Jesus’ words as does the NASB, “Allow it at this time; for in this way it is fitting for us to fulfill all righteousness.”
The purpose of this baptism is much more than accepting repentance of sin. It is about ‘fulfilling all righteousness.’ Ultimately, by means of this baptism of the children of God, all righteousness will be restored to earth.
Setting an example for us, Jesus was presenting himself to do God’s will. The symbology of full immersion in water conveys the idea of dying to a former way of life and being reborn, or born again, to a new way of life. Jesus speaks of being “born again” at John 3:3, but that phrase is a translation of two Greek words that literally mean, “born from above” and John speaks of this in other places as being “born of God”. (See 1 John 3:9; 4:7)
We will be dealing with being “born again” or “born of God” in a forthcoming future video.
Notice what happened immediately after Jesus came out of the water? The Holy Spirit descended upon him. God the Father anointed Jesus with his holy spirit. At this moment, and not before, Jesus becomes the Christ or the Messiah—specifically, the anointed one. In ancient times, they would pour oil on the head of someone—that is what “anointed” means—to anoint them to some high position. The prophet Samuel poured oil, anointed, David to make him king of Israel. Jesus is the greater David. Likewise, the children of God are anointed, to rule with Jesus in his kingdom for the salvation of humankind.
Of these, Revelation 5:9, 10 says,
“Worthy are you to take the scroll and to open its seals, for you were slain, and by your blood you ransomed people for God from every tribe and language and people and nation, and you have made them a kingdom and priests to our God, and they shall reign on the earth.” (Revelation 5:9, 10 ESV)
But the father doesn’t just pour out the Holy Spirit upon his son, he speaks from heaven saying, “this is my son, the beloved, whom I have approved.” Matthew 3:17
What an example God set for us. He told Jesus what every son or daughter yearns to hear from their father.
- He acknowledged him: “this is my son”
- He declared his love: “the beloved”
- And expressed his approval: “whom I have approved”
“I claim you as my child. I love you. I’m proud of you.”
We must realize that when we take this step to be baptized, this is how our heavenly father feels about us individually. He is claiming us as his child. He loves us. And he is proud of the step we have taken. There was no great pomp and circumstance to the simple act of baptism that Jesus instituted with John. Nevertheless, the ramifications are so profound to the individual as to be beyond words to express fully.
People have asked me repeatedly, “How can I go about getting baptized?” Well now you know. There is the example set by Jesus.
Ideally, you should find another Christian to perform the baptism, but if you cannot, then realize it’s a mechanical process and any human can do it, male or female. John the Baptist was not a Christian. The person doing the baptism does not confer upon you any special status. John was a sinner, not qualified even to untie the sandal that Jesus worn. It is the act of baptism itself that is important: the full immersion into and out of water. It is like signing a document. The pen you use doesn’t hold any legal value. It is your signature that matters.
Of course, when I get my driver’s license, it is with the understanding that I agree to obey the traffic laws. Likewise, when I get baptized, it is with the understanding that I will live my life by the high moral standard set by Jesus himself.
But given all that, let us not complicate the procedure unnecessarily. Consider as a guide, this Bible account:
“Tell me,” said the eunuch, “who is the prophet talking about, himself or someone else?”
Then Philip began with this very Scripture and told him the good news about Jesus.
As they traveled along the road and came to some water, the eunuch said, “Look, here is water! What is there to prevent me from being baptized?” And he gave orders to stop the chariot. Then both Philip and the eunuch went down into the water, and Philip baptized him.
When they came up out of the water, the Spirit of the Lord carried Philip away, and the eunuch saw him no more, but went on his way rejoicing. (Acts 8:34-39 BSB)
The Ethiopian sees a body of water, and asks: “What prevents me from being baptized?” Evidently, nothing. Because Philip quickly baptized him and then they each went on their separate way. Only two people are mentioned although there was somebody driving the chariot evidently, but we only hear about Philip and the Ethiopian eunuch. All you need is yourself, someone else, and a body of water.
Try to avoid religious ceremonies if at all possible. Remember the devil wants to invalidate your baptism. He doesn’t want people to be born again, to have the Holy Spirit descend upon them and anoint them as one of God’s children. Let us take one example of how he is accomplished this sinister work.
The Ethiopian eunuch could never have been baptized as one of Jehovah’s Witnesses because first he would have had to answer something like 100 questions to even qualify. If he answered all of them correctly, then he would have had to answer two more questions in the affirmative at the time of his baptism.
(1) “Have you repented of your sins, dedicated yourself to Jehovah, and accepted his way of salvation through Jesus Christ?”
(2) “Do you understand that your baptism identifies you as one of Jehovah’s Witnesses in association with Jehovah’s organization?”
If you are unfamiliar with this, you might wonder why the second question is needed? After all, are Witnesses getting baptized in the name of Jesus Christ, or in the name of the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society? The reason for the second question is to address legal issues. They want to attach your baptism as a Christian to membership in the organization of Jehovah’s Witnesses so that they cannot be sued for revoking your membership. What this amounts to essentially is essentially that if you’re disfellowshipped, they have revoked your baptism.
But let’s not waste time with the second question, because the real sin involves the first one.
Here is how the Bible defines baptism, and notice that I’m using the New World translation since we are dealing with a doctrine of Jehovah’s Witnesses.
“Baptism, which corresponds to this, is also now saving you (not by the removing of the filth of the flesh, but by the request to God for a good conscience), through the resurrection of Jesus Christ.” (1 Peter 3:21)
So baptism is a request or appeal to God to have a good conscience. You know you are a sinner, and that you sin constantly in many ways. But because you have taken the step to get baptized so as to show the world that you now belong to the Christ, you have a basis for asking for forgiveness and getting it. The grace of God is extended to us through baptism through the resurrection of Jesus Christ, and so he washes our conscience clean.
When Peter says that “which corresponds to this” he’s referring to what is stated in the previous verse. He refers to Noah and the building of the ark and likens it to being baptized. Noah had faith, but that faith was not a passive thing. That faith induced him to take a stand in a wicked world and build the ark and obey the command of God. Likewise, when we obey the command of God, we get baptized, we identify ourselves as a faithful servant of God. Like the act of building the ark and entering into it, it is baptism that saves us, because the act of being baptized allows God to pour out his Holy Spirit upon us just as he did with his son when his son performed the same act. Through that spirit, we are born again or born of God.
Of course, that’s not good enough for the Society of Jehovah’s Witnesses. They have a different definition of baptism claiming that it corresponds or is symbolic of something else.
Jehovah’s Witnesses believe that baptism is a symbol of one’s dedication to God. The Insight book reads, “In a corresponding way, those who would dedicate themselves to Jehovah on the basis of faith in the resurrected Christ, get baptized in symbol of that…” (it-1 p. 251 Baptism)
“…she decided to go ahead and get baptized in symbol of her dedication to Jehovah God.” (w16 December p. 3)
But there is still more to it. This dedication is accomplished by swearing an oath or making a vow of dedication.
The Watchtower of 1987 tells us this:
“Humans who come to love the true God and who determine to serve him completely should dedicate their lives to Jehovah and then be baptized.”
“This accords with the general meaning of “vow,” as in the definition: “a solemn promise or undertaking, especially in the form of an oath to God.”—Oxford American Dictionary, 1980, page 778.
Consequently, it does not seem necessary to limit the use of the word “vow.” A person who decides to serve God may feel that, for him, his unreserved dedication amounts to a personal vow—a vow of dedication. He ‘solemnly promises or undertakes to do something,’ which is what a vow is. In this case, it is to use his life to serve Jehovah, doing His will faithfully. Such an individual should feel seriously about this. It should be as with the psalmist, who, referring to things that he had vowed, said: “What shall I repay to Jehovah for all his benefits to me? The cup of grand salvation I shall take up, and on the name of Jehovah I shall call. My vows I shall pay to Jehovah.”—Psalm 116:12-14” (w87 4/15 p. 31 Questions From Readers)
Notice that they acknowledge that a vow is a sworn oath to God. They also acknowledge this vow comes before one gets baptized, and we’ve already seen that they believe that baptism is a symbol of this oath-bound dedication. Finally, they close their line of reasoning by citing the Psalm that says “My vows I shall pay to Jehovah”.
Okay, it all seems well and good, doesn’t it? It seems logical to say that we should dedicate our lives to God, doesn’t it? In fact, there was a study article in The Watchtower just a few years ago all about baptism, and the title of the article was, “What You Vow, Pay”. (See April, 2017 Watchtower p. 3) The theme text for the article was Matthew 5:33, but in what has become more and more typical, they only quoted a part of the verse: “You must pay your vows to Jehovah.”
All of this is so wrong I hardly know where to start. Well, that’s not exactly true. I do know where to start. Let’s start with a word search. If you use the Watchtower Library program, and search on the word “baptism” as a noun or verb, you will find well over 100 occurrences in the Christian Greek Scriptures to baptism or being baptized. Obviously, a symbol is less important than the reality it represents. Therefore, if the symbol occurs 100 times and more one would expect the reality – in this case the vow of dedication – to occur as much or more. It doesn’t occur even once. There is no record of any Christian making a vow of dedication. In fact, the word dedication as a noun or verb occurs only four times in the Christian Scriptures. In one instance, at John 10:22 it refers to a Jewish Festival, the festival of dedication. In another, it refers to the dedicated things of the Jewish temple which were going to be overthrown. (Luke 21:5, 6) The other two instances both refer to the same parable of Jesus in which something dedicated is cast in a very unfavorable light.
“. . .But YOU men say, ‘If a man says to his father or his mother: “Whatever I have by which you may get benefit from me is corban, (that is, a gift dedicated to God,)”’— YOU men no longer let him do a single thing for his father or his mother,” (Mark 7:11, 12—See also Matthew 15:4-6)
Now think about this. If baptism is a symbol of dedication and if every person getting baptized was supposed to make a vow to God of dedication before being immersed in water, why is the Bible silent about this? Why doesn’t the Bible tell us to make this vow before getting baptized? Does that make any sense? Did Jesus forget to tell us about this vital requirement? I don’t think so, do you?
The Governing Body of Jehovah’s Witnesses has made this up. They have fabricated a false requirement. In doing so, they have not only corrupted the baptismal process but have induced Jehovah’s Witnesses to disobey a direct command of Jesus Christ. Let me explain.
Going back to the aforementioned 2017 Watchtower article, let’s read the whole of the context of the articles theme text.
“Again you heard that it was said to those of ancient times: ‘You must not swear without performing, but you must pay your vows to Jehovah.’ However, I say to you: Do not swear at all, neither by heaven, for it is God’s throne; nor by earth, for it is the footstool of his feet; nor by Jerusalem, for it is the city of the great King. Do not swear by your head, since you cannot turn one hair white or black. Just let your word ‘Yes’ mean yes, your ‘No,’ no, for what goes beyond these is from the wicked one.” (Matthew 5:33-37 NWT)
The point the Watchtower article is making is that you have to keep your vow of dedication, but the point Jesus is making is that the making of vows is a thing of the past. He commands us not to do it anymore. He goes so far as to say that making vows or swearing oaths comes from the wicked one. That would be Satan. So here we have the organization of Jehovah’s Witnesses requiring Jehovah’s Witnesses to make a vow, to swear an oath to God of dedication, when Jesus tells them not only not to do that, but warns them that it comes from a satanic source.
In defense of the watchtower doctrine, some have said, “What’s wrong with being dedicated to God? Are we not all dedicated to God?” What? Are you smarter than God? Are you going to start telling God what baptism means? What father gathers his children around him and tells them, “Listen, I love you, but that’s not enough. I want you to be dedicated to me. I want you to swear an oath of dedication to me?”
There is a reason this is not a requirement. It doubles down on sin. You see, I’m going to sin. As I’m born in sin. And I’m going to have to pray to God to forgive me. But if I have sworn an oath of dedication, that means that if I sin, I have in that moment, the moment of that sin ceased to be dedicated servant of God and have become dedicated or devoted to sin as my master. I have broken my oath, my vow. So now I have to repent for the sin itself, and then repent for the broken vow. Two sins. But it gets worse. You see, a vow is a kind of contract.
Let me illustrate it this way: we make wedding vows. The Bible doesn’t require us to make wedding vows and no one in the Bible is shown making a wedding vow, but we do make wedding vows nowadays so I will use that for this illustration. The husband vows to be faithful to his wife. What happens if he goes out and sleeps with another woman? He has broken his vow. That means the wife is no longer required to hold up her end of the marriage contract. She is free to remarry, because the vow has been broken and rendered null and void.
So, if you vow to God to be dedicated to him and then sin and break that dedication, that vow, you have rendered the verbal contract null and void. God does not have to hold up his end of the bargain anymore. That means that each time you sin and repent you have to make a new vow of dedication. It gets ridiculous.
If God required us to make a vow like this as part of the baptismal process, he would be setting us up for failure. He would be guaranteeing our failure because we cannot live without sinning; therefore, we cannot live without breaking the vow. He wouldn’t do that. He hasn’t done that. Baptism is a commitment we make to do our best within our sinful state to serve God. That is all he asks of us. If we do that, he pours out his grace on us, and it is his grace through the power of the Holy Spirit that saves us because of the resurrection of Jesus Christ.
Both my driver’s license and my insurance policy give me the legal right to drive in Canada. I still have to obey the rules of the road, of course. My baptism in the name of Jesus together with my regular observance of the Lord’s evening meal fulfill the requirements for me to call myself a Christian. Of course, I still have to obey the rules of the road, the road leading to life.
However, for the vast majority of Christians, their driver’s license is fake and their insurance policy is invalid. In the case of Jehovah’s Witnesses, they have so perverted baptism as to make it meaningless. And then they deny people the right to partake of the emblems, and go so far as to require them to be present and reject them publicly. Catholics baptized children by sprinkling water on them, completely shirking the example of water baptism set by Jesus. When it comes to partaking of the Lord’s evening meal, their laity only get half a meal, the bread—except for certain high masses. Further, they teach the fallacy that the wine magically transforms itself into real human blood as it goes down the pallet. Those are just two examples of how Satan has perverted the two requirements all Christians must meet through organized religion. He must be rubbing his hands and laughing with glee.
To all who are still uncertain, if you want to be baptized, find a Christian – they’re all over the place – ask him or her to go with you to a pool or a pond or hot tub or even a bathtub, and get baptized in the name of Jesus Christ. It is between you and God, who through baptism you will call “Abba or dear Father”. There is no need to utter a special phrase or some ritualistic incantation
If you wish to have the person baptizing you, or even yourself, say I’m getting baptized in the name of Jesus Christ, go ahead. Or if you just want to know this in your heart as you get baptised, that works as well. Again, there is no special ritual here. What there is, is a deep commitment in your heart between you and God that you are willing to be accepted as one of his children through the act of baptism and to receive the outpouring of holy spirit that adopts you.
It is so very simple, and yet at the same time so profound and life altering. I really hope this has answered any questions you may have regarding baptism. If not, please place your comments in the comments section, or send me an email at meleti.vivlon@gmail.com, and I’ll do my best to answer them.
Thank you for watching and for your ongoing support.
I don’t quite understand this about baptism I thought that since I was baptized as a Jehovah’s Witness I am baptized in Jesus name am I incorrect in thinking this please help and thank you
It is really a matter of conscience. You have to decide what feels right for you.
Hi Donna, you asked, I was baptized as a Jehovah’s Witness I am baptized in Jesus name am I incorrect I didn’t see anyone answer your question. It depends on what year you were baptized on how you were baptized, as the Watchtower of Jehovah’s Witnesses has changed their process for baptism multiple times. You can do a Google search from those changes and the ‘dedication and baptism vows’ to see what the “vows” were the year you were baptized. For example, in the most recent set you vow you have “dedicated yourself to Jehovah, and accepted his way” which… Read more »
This is just a word to the wise. Any comments made on this form should be expressed with respect and consideration for the feelings not only of the person being directly addressed, but for those of everyone else who will read your words. The Spirit of Christ, not the spirit of contention nor of self-righteousness, should be pervasive in all our words. If a comment doesn’t meet this criteria, it will be removed. Likewise, any comment that uses logical fallacies will be deleted. This means no ad hominem attacks. Also, given the damage we have seen caused by lies that… Read more »
One more link to research:
https://jw.fail
Ilya, I have reviewed your website, and I’ll prepare a write-up jw.fail as soon as I am able. Meanwhile, should you wish to better educate yourself regarding Matthew 28:19 as written in your bible, I have responded on my own website (to preserve my research): http://obible.org/articles/baptizing-into-the-name-of-the-father-the-son-and-the-holy-spirit/ I find it disconcerting anyone would teach against a command of Christ without evidence. Bible translations are not manuscripts, and conjecture is not evidence nor fact. While it seems my sincere questions are being ignored, my question stands regarding Acts 8:14-17 — what name should they have been baptized in other than “the Lord Jesus… Read more »
I have answered yesterday to your questions. See bottom, please.
I think you are assuming that had they been baptized in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit, they would have received the Holy Spirit and thus the laying on of hands recorded in vs 17 would not have been necessary. It that correct?
I elaborated more on the meaning of “into” vs “in” in a response below. “into” at Matthew 28:19 means ‘in recognition of’ as Brother Franz also taught. in one Spirit we all were baptized into one body — 1 Cor 12:13, BLB “in” at Acts 2:38 means ‘of that upon which any action, effect, condition, rests as a basis or support; properly, upon the ground of’ according to Strong’s. Given someone understands “into” (Matt 28:19) in the same manner as Brother Franz taught, then I move to Acts 19:1-7. They were clearly not baptized “into the name of the Son…… Read more »
You still do not understand, Angela. You need to TRANSLATE the word “baptize”.
dip, wash, cleanse, immerse = baptize
“Peter said to them: “Repent, and let each one of you be dipped in the name of Jesus the Anointed One for forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the free gift of the holy spirit.” Acts 2:38
“will cleanse you with holy spirit and with fire” Matthew 3:11
Simple!
I did not enjoy being assigned doing research, and I did not enjoy annotating this site.
I did not ask for homework, I asked questions you have not answered.
Here is the review of jw.fail.
http://obible.org/articles/wp-content/uploads/2021/04/jw.fail_en.png
<img src=”http://obible.org/articles/wp-content/uploads/2021/04/jw.fail_en.png”>
I would prefer that we reserve the comment section for comments, not debates. Debates can create an unpleasant atmosphere for many. If readers of this forum would like to debate a subject, I would ask them to open a discussion on discussthetruth.com. Thank you.
Thank you, will do.
Eric, it’s Angela here. Before your video I had not heard anyone teaching that Matthew 28:19 was spurious, nor anyone teaching that you do not need to be baptized “in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit”. (I understand some judge 1 John 5:7-8 spurious though, for the same reason.) However, in my own bible study I know that at Acts 8:14-17 (BLB): “…the apostles… they prayed for them to receive the Holy Spirit. For He was not yet fallen upon any of them, but they had only been baptized into the name of the Lord Jesus. Then… Read more »
Hi Angela, Something to bear in mind is the fact that Acts 8:14-17 isn’t referring to the anointing of holy spirit that comes upon all Christians that leads us to the truth and seals us as God’s Children, but to the special imparting of the gifts of the spirit such as speaking in tongues. The later only came about by the laying on of hands, or by special manifestations such as happened with Cornelius. However, the fact is that the passage you refer to is consistent with all other passages in NT scripture describing the act of baptizing someone. No… Read more »
Ponder…
Please read carefully Romans 6 and especially put your attention on next verses:
3 Or do you not know that all of us who were dipped into the Anointed Jesus were dipped into his death?
4 So we were buried with him through our dipping into his death, in order that just as the Anointed One was raised up from the dead through the glory of the Father, so we also should walk in a newness of life.
Ponder, can you replace Jesus with or add to Jesus: Jehovah God? holy spirit?
Hi Ilya, I thought I’d replied, but perhaps it didn’t post properly. I read Romans 6 through as you suggested, and found it ironic it refers to the baptism of water for the repentance of sins and gives us the definition of the symbolism of that act, which begun with the baptism of John. My question had been about the account in Acts specifically referring to their being baptized “only in the name of the Lord” at Acts 8:16. It’s a biblical question, and not to replace the “name of the Lord Jesus” because “only” implies there would be at… Read more »
Your comment was removed by Meleti Vivlon (Eric). Pls read above.
“This is just a word to the wise. Any comments made on this form should be expressed with respect and consideration for the feelings not only of the person being directly addressed, but for those of everyone else who will read your words”
I was baptized as JW on 19.03.2000 at age 16, and re-dipped as simple christian 25.08.2020 ONLY in the name of Jesus the Anointed One.
Please read more about baptism at http://www.jw.fail
Nowadays it does not matter if it is Jesus or Yeshua, use the one you prefer, no need to be as pharisees 🙂 Romans 6 is NOT about John’s dipping!!! It is about christian dipping. To understand the word “baptism” you need to STOP to use it. It is untranslated greek word. You’ll never understand without it meaning of the Jesus’ words: “Indeed, I have a baptism with which to be baptized, and how I am distressed until it is finished!” (Luke 12:50) dip, wash, cleanse, immerse = baptize Jesus was/is clean and perfect, and already as Aointed One (Christ/Messiah)… Read more »
I have thought a lot about this over the past few days. I am inclined towards the belief that my JW baptism is not valid as it is not in line with early Christian baptism, although I am still thinking it through. Back at the beginning it would have been quite straightforward. Believers would have been baptised by the person who taught them about Jesus, or one of their companions. This applies from the mass baptisms in early Acts, to Cornelius and his family (maybe in a Roman bathtub!) and of course to the Ethiopian. Now that Ethiopian would have… Read more »
You have to work within your own conscience. Just bear in mind that this is all deductive reasoning. There are no specific rules laid down in the Bible about qualifications for those performing baptisms.
Je suis surprise par l’idée que Jean Baptiste n’était pas un chrétien. Bien sûr les disciples du Christ furent appelés chrétiens plus tard et le Christ mourut plus tard. Mais est ce le plus important cette question de temps ? Jean Baptiste a reconnu le Christ comme l’envoyé de Dieu, l’agneau qui ote le péché du monde. N’est ce pas là la caractéristique d’un chrétien ? Ce sont les hommes (par providence divine ?) qui ont appelé les disciples du Christ “chrétiens”. N’auraient ils pas qualifié Jean Baptiste de disciple de Christ donc de chrétien? Comment Christ aurait pu être… Read more »
Je ne suggère pas que Jean ne sera pas avec les enfants de Dieu. De même, Abraham, Moïse et David, entre autres, seront inclus parmi les enfants de Dieu. Je dis seulement qu’aucun d’entre eux n’était chrétien. Se sont-ils tournés vers le Christ pour le salut? Oui, mais être chrétien est autre chose. Le mot signifie «oint». Les chrétiens sont oints de l’esprit saint après leur baptême. Jean n’a pas baptisé les autres comme chrétiens. Vous vous souviendrez peut-être qu’Apollos et 12 autres croyaient en Jésus et le prêchaient mais n’avaient pas reçu l’esprit saint parce qu’ils avaient été baptisés… Read more »
Je ne pensais pas du tout que tu rabaissais Jean Baptiste. Nous sommes d’accord, il est un enfant de Dieu, le plus juste selon Jésus, que la terre ait porté. Christ = oint = christos Chrétien = mot grec Χριστιανός (khristianos) — « disciple du Christ » — est dérivé du mot Χριστός (Christos) — celui qui est oint — avec une fin adjectivale empruntée au latin qui signifie « adhérer à » ou « faire partie de” Ou disciple de Christ, adepte de Christ. Il ne me semble pas que chrétien signifie “oint” mais “disciple de l’oint” . C’est… Read more »
Même si nous acceptons la définition que Chrétien signifie «Disciple du Christ», cela montre toujours que Jean n’était pas chrétien parce qu’il n’était pas un disciple du Christ. Il avait ses propres disciples et ils étaient distincts des disciples du Christ, et ils sont allés au Christ pour demander s’il était le Christ ou s’ils devaient en attendre un autre. «. . .Mais Jean, ayant entendu parler en prison des oeuvres du Christ, envoya ses disciples pour lui demander: «Es-tu celui qui vient, ou devons-nous en attendre un autre?» (Matthieu 11: 2, 3) Even if we accept the definition that… Read more »
Il est vrai que les paroles de Jean Baptiste : “devons nous en attendre un autre ?” m’ont laissée parfois perplexe. Pourtant lui même a dit : “Pour moi, je vous baptise avec de l’eau à cause de votre repentance ; mais celui qui vient après moi est plus fort que moi, [celui] dont je ne suis pas digne d’enlever les sandales. Celui-là vous baptisera avec de l’esprit saint et avec du feu… il ramassera son blé dans le magasin ; mais la bale, il la brûlera par un feu qu’il est impossible d’éteindre.” C’est moi qui ai besoin d’être baptisé par… Read more »
https://www.trinitytruth.org/matthew28_19addedtext.html
http://bishopjerrylhayes.blogspot.com/2015/08/matthew-2819-and-1-john-57-spurious.html
Eric, regarding the links you shared https://www.trinitytruth.org/matthew28_19addedtext.html There is no such biblical word as the “Godhead”, as I’m sure you know. Eusebius quotes many verses in his writings including Matthew 28:19 several times. But he never quotes it as it appears in modern Bibles. He always finishes the verse with the words “in my name.” Your source is factually wrong. Eusebius quotes Matthew 28:19 multiple times as it appears in modern Bibles. This man is factually wrong stating, he “always finishes the verse with the words “in my name.”“ As a matter of fact, Eusebius quotes the verse in one… Read more »
Qui peut vraiment savoir si Mathieu 28 : 19 a été modifié ? Nous n’avons effectivement pas les manuscrits de Mathieu 28 du début du siècle. Prétendre que des hommes l’ont rajouté me fait penser à ce que prétend la société WT quand elle dit que YHWH a été supprimé du Nouveau Testament. Aucune preuve. Beaucoup de manuscrits du debut de l’ère chrétienne ont été brûlés en raison de la persécution. De toutes facons, ces paroles “au nom du Père, du Fils et du Saint Esprit” : – ne prouvent en rien la Trinité. Au contraire, il parle de 3… Read more »
Les suppositions sont des deux côtés de la question. Puisque tous les manuscrits avant le troisième siècle ne contiennent pas le dernier chapitre de Matthieu, nous ne pouvons pas affirmer avec certitude que Matthieu 24:19 n’a pas été falsifié ni affirmer que c’est vrai. Ce dernier ne peut être affirmé parce qu’il n’y a aucune corroboration dans d’autres parties de la Bible pour le soutenir, puisque tous les baptêmes enregistrés dans le Nouveau Testament ont été faits uniquement au nom de Jésus. The guesses are on both sides of the question. Since all the manuscripts before the third century do not… Read more »
Hi Eric. You started a very interesting but certainly controversial topic and I would like to express my position on the whole matter. I have discussed the question of the validity of the WT baptism several times and it has always been a long discussion with a not always clear conclusion. Determining the validity of someone’s baptism, even on the basis of biblical verses, is not easy. Here we enter the territory of everyone’s personal conscience and their relationship with God. This thing can be justly judged by Jesus only (John 2:25). My following comments are based on my current… Read more »
Of course ideally one should be baptized by someone who believes as one does, but failing that, by a believer in Jesus Christ. However, what if there is no fellow Christian? Should one forgo baptism in that case? What if it was impossible to find another human. I can’t really see a scenario like that, but the point is, is it a ritual or is it a commitment to God. If a ritual, then God would say I don’t care how you feel about me, if you don’t do it the way I want you to do it, it is… Read more »
Nicely said, Eric. This was the very first crack in the dam for me in 2015 when I addressed the “dedication vow to Jehovah before I one gets baptised issue” with a couple of elders. I also vented my frustration at a Watchtower study to do with young ones and baptism and was subsequently asked into the back room. There is so much hypocrisy here it’s hard to even start. I remember first reading an article from perimeno.ca about dedication, baptism and covenant relationships. This is regarding JW’s of course. JW’s try to make the word “covenant” and “dedication” interchangeable.… Read more »
I was B at about 12 in the Church of Christ. Many years later with its long story i went for B at a wt convention. As I and others were changing before the event some “elder”-? came in and asked if anyone was being B for the second time. Me and one other raised our hands. This elder assumed the most smug look and left the room. We all looked at each other confused.
So something was going on there.?
Ooooh boy…,. I feel I have been waiting for this article for a long time. And now it is time for some deep inward reflection.
Thank you
Perfect, Eric! Pure truth! Dipping only in the name of Jesus the Anointed One.
I have re-dipped previous summer and feel truly happy as simple christian.
Btw lie of JWs is also that baptism is impossible without an affirmative answer to the next question: “Do you believe that the Governing Body of Jehovah’s Witnesses is ‘the faithful and discreet slave’ appointed by Jesus?”
https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1102014952#h=39
Wow just noticed that question for the first time, its all about them.
I think I was baptised properly. Was reminded and questioned on this point, and come to the conclusion that either one of two things happened: by further studying God’s Word, as we’re encouraged to do, I learned that this is not true; or the GB was appointed as “faithful and discreet slave” and have abandoned their assignment to go their own way, like oftentimes happened with the Israelites, as the Hebrew Scriptures show us. Remember that our present beliefs are based on partial knowledge (1 Cor. 13:9,10). As we get to a better understanding of truth and Jehovah’s purposes, we… Read more »
Yes, let us not use this Bible research (not religious) forum for off-topic debates.
I’m sorry to see this. It’s quite like the reactions I have become familiar with in the congregation, especially from the elders. It is ironic how you go the accurate way above, suggesting corrections to the text on the claims and evidence around Matthew 28:19, but here you just resort to rejecting as “conspiracy theory”, “rumors” and “misinformation” whatever it is that you find to be that. I tend to put up with a lot, and I have been fine taking verbal abuse for being a Witness from people who felt negative about it for their own personal reasons. However,… Read more »
Hi Just Wondering.
May I have one question for you, very biblical and very actual with respect to vaccination. Again, very biblical question, no off-Bible question, although off-topic regarding this video theme:
“Is abortion a murder?”
Your answer – a) Yes, b) No, c) I don’t know
Of course you don’t have to answer.
Frankie
Thanx, Ad_Lang! You can research and compare at:
https://jw.fail
What says Jehovah and what JWs.
About your second dot-statement: “For there is […] one mediator between God and humans, a man Jesus, the Anointed One”
1 Timothy 2:5
Without other intermediaries.
Without slaves.
Without organizations or modern churches.
Without governing body.
Great site, thanks! It actually teaches me something about myself. Something I have come to know already recently, but understanding the consequences is a whole different thing. I tend to believe the best of people, on face value considering their motives and intentions are honest and decent. Some call it naive, I think there’s a bit more to it. We live in a very judgmental world, which is the complete opposite: some people do find fault with everything about others, what they do, say etc. I feel strongly against that. And so it happened to me that I fell from… Read more »
Thanks Ilya. That is one of the baptism questions that a person must go through with the elders. Another involves enjoying meetings and commenting, while one that discusses Leviticus 5:1 does not even try to consider the verses as in the 2013 NWT. The subject is based on the incorrect translation in the previous NWT. I doubt that any younger person would even suspect those questions are misleading. However, the one you raise is the worst of the lot, in my opinion. What any of those questions has to do with being a baptised Christian, I leave others to tell… Read more »